The Free Talk Live BBS
Free Talk Live => The Show => Topic started by: Grey on June 02, 2010, 12:16:52 AM
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...nicely done, guys. It was definitely long overdue.
Ah, but talk about a cliffhanger: With the caller bringing up the probably most polarizing issue amongst liberty-type folk (immigration, of course.) Whew. Really left me wanting more, and I can't wait til you guys have this debate/discussion w/ Jones.
For me, I can see both POV's, and I'm still not fully committed to either side (however I'm leaning towards the FTL POV).
Anyway, excellent show... can't wait to hear the follow-up?
I'm just curious though, Mark and Ian - did this change your view of him in any manner?
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I have the day off of work tomorrow, so I cant wait to give this episode my full attention. Should be fun.
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Definitely listening to this.It should be great.
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I'm just curious though, Mark and Ian - did this change your view of him in any manner?
I like him more. I feel more connected to the guy. Over the years my respect for him has grown, but some of his followers are bat-sh*t crazy.
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I'm just curious though, Mark and Ian - did this change your view of him in any manner?
I like him more. I feel more connected to the guy. Over the years my respect for him has grown, but some of his followers are bat-sh*t crazy.
Yeah, I could tell - all of you guys definitely seemed to connect pretty well. Sure, no doubt a lot of his followers are nuts, but so are some of yours. You can't control who likes you, just what you say. That reminds me of people who were attacking RP b/c some racists supported him. Hey, it's not his fault; he can only be responsible for how he reacts to it. I think he reacted pretty well.
I digress.
I can't wait for the debate on immigration. I respect FTL's and AJ's opinions a lot; I think I'll finally be able to make up my mind on it. Likewise, I'm also really looking forward to a discussion on 9/11 or conspiracies (NWO) talk, in general and how it relates to attaining liberty. You guys (Ian/Mark specifically) seem to like to dismiss it as not important or just not true and that it's distracting or a turn-off to people trying to attain liberty. Jones, of course, sees it otherwise. Either way, it's going to make for excellent radio. Maybe it could be a regular thing? (not even a debate, just having each other on the other's show?) Just some ideas...
I think you guys have ultimately the same goal, and this is a chance to really bring together the FTL types w/ the AJ types. I'm already reconsidering re-Amping you guys after just this one show - I bet others feel the same way. And no, I'm definitely not suggesting changing your principles for a few bucks, I already know FTL is far superior to anything like that. I don't expect you guys to see eye to eye on everything, but I think open discussion can only help clear up any misunderstandings b/w you guys and AJ, as well as us, the listeners.
BTW, any indication when you guys will get the debate on the go?
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I had heard very, very little from Alex Jones before this show, but the impression I got was that he's about half as crazy as his average listener.
...With the caller bringing up the probably most polarizing issue amongst liberty-type folk (immigration, of course.)
I used to think a libertarian (or whatever you want to call them, eg. "liberty-type folk") could take a principled (albeit incorrect) anti-immigration stance, but I've lately come to the conclusion that this is very unlikely.
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I hope you'll have him on more often, maybe make it a once-a-month sorta thing. He can bring a lot of people into the Free State Project - maybe not the best "quality" of people but quantity helps as well. The great thing about freedom is that we only have to agree to leave each-other alone, while we can disagree on everything else.
(Of course for me the Free State Project failed when assholezilla's started modding this forum. Makes me glad I stopped AMP'ing when I did... It proves that FSP is still too centralized and too prone to a cult of personality. Seasteading FTW!)
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Agreed with Mark. I generally like the guy and liked him more after this interview. I think it could be a way to bring people to the FSP - many that will convert from angry libertarians to enlightened voluntarists. Alex is fairly positive though I think he thinks the solution is in the system. Would like you guys to do a simulcast if possible though schedules might not align.
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I kept waiting for them to talk about conspiracy theories and how they drive people away from communication about liberty. I'd like to hear Alex answer the tough questions they pose to 9/11 "truthers." I know he's got better answers to those than the "clones" do:
So, what are you gonna do about it once everyone believes what you say?
Don't you think the plain, out-in-the-open evil of government is a bit easier to point people to than something you have to explain in great detail?
Etc.
Yeah, I know you have to start with the rapport, but Ian kept acting like he was gonna hold his feet to the fire.
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I kept waiting for them to talk about conspiracy theories and how they drive people away from communication about liberty. I'd like to hear Alex answer the tough questions they pose to 9/11 "truthers." I know he's got better answers to those than the "clones" do:
I see your point about it potentially driving people away from the path to liberty; however, as I said initially, for me, it helped steer me onto a more liberty-oriented path.
I'd love to see Alex answer the tough questions, too. (especially in regards to Immigration) Likewise, I'd like to see FTL be confronted w/ the tough questions on 9/11.
Yeah, I was kinda disappointed, in a way. Ian wasn't his typical, blunt self and he didn't really question Alex too hard. But, not that I blame him, once AJ got going on anything, it was hard to shut him up. Also, I think, Ian and the others were just trying to get a "feel" for Jones and his views, and his general tone before really digging into anything too deep.
But hey, don't take it from me, I wish Ian or Mark (besides the one comment he said) would speak to this some more...
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I kept waiting for them to talk about conspiracy theories and how they drive people away from communication about liberty. I'd like to hear Alex answer the tough questions they pose to 9/11 "truthers." I know he's got better answers to those than the "clones" do:
I see your point about it potentially driving people away from the path to liberty; however, as I said initially, for me, it helped steer me onto a more liberty-oriented path.
I'd love to see Alex answer the tough questions, too. (especially in regards to Immigration) Likewise, I'd like to see FTL be confronted w/ the tough questions on 9/11.
Yeah, I was kinda disappointed, in a way. Ian wasn't his typical, blunt self and he didn't really question Alex too hard. But, not that I blame him, once AJ got going on anything, it was hard to shut him up. Also, I think, Ian and the others were just trying to get a "feel" for Jones and his views, and his general tone before really digging into anything too deep.
But hey, don't take it from me, I wish Ian or Mark (besides the one comment he said) would speak to this some more...
Well, to be blunt, I don't want to argue about it here any more. We know there are differences, and they've been thoroughly hashed out here many times, but I did want to hear them talk about the bases for difference of opinion on those things. I know Alex will have a more developed idea of the salience of 9/11 controversy than we tend to hear. My opinion hasn't been swayed toward caring about 9/11's significance yet, and I thought he'd have the best shot at it. I'm not sure there are any tough questions for Ian and Mark WRT 9/11.
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(Of course for me the Free State Project failed when assholezilla's started modding this forum. Makes me glad I stopped AMP'ing when I did... It proves that FSP is still too centralized and too prone to a cult of personality. Seasteading FTW!)
You seem to be quite confused.
I'm not sure there are any tough questions for Ian and Mark WRT 9/11.
Right; how could there be? Debating whether the U.S. Government perpetrated 9/11 is like debating whether Jack the Ripper was a jaywalker.
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I'm not sure there are any tough questions for Ian and Mark WRT 9/11.
Right; how could there be? Debating whether the U.S. Government perpetrated 9/11 is like debating whether Jack the Ripper was a jaywalker.
At the risk of baiting the "truth" crowd, that's it in a nutshell, for me.
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I forgot to post my follow-up. The episode was awesome! New respect for Alex Jones.
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Where can I download this show? I don't have internet at home and I don't want to sit in the library and watch it on You Tube.
(Not the FTL episode, the Alex Jones show with Ian & Mark.)
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Archives, find the date.
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Who is Alex Jones?
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Yeah, I'm not gonna search through a 4 hour podcast to find what they had to say. Seriously, a FOUR HOUR PODCAST?
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Yeah, I'm not gonna search through a 4 hour podcast to find what they had to say. Seriously, a FOUR HOUR PODCAST?
did you try youtubing it? it's on there...
also, itunes has a nice list (by date) of the archives, and also, the two of them were on for like the last 20-30 mins of the 4 hr podcast. Pretty easy to find.