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Author Topic: Libertarianism and Religion  (Read 39157 times)

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Level 20 Anklebiter

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #90 on: February 19, 2009, 10:59:07 PM »


guy in the sky is supposed to be all-knowing...which would mean that guy in the sky knows BEFORE you are created...whether or not you are going to heaven or hell...

sounds pretty fucked up to me that I would create a child only to pour gasoline on it and set it on fire for eternity...

merciful my fucking ass...

all bow before the guy in the sky with the gasoline and matches...that's ready, willing, and able to set your ass on fire if you don't play UNO just so...

onward christian soldiers...and all that bullshit...

you and your guy in the sky can go find a deserted island to run your supertanker full of gasoline into...

just keep that shit totally to yourself and your fellow gasoline-and-matches guy in the sky worshipers...




Well to answer your question, let me clear up a few errors on your part...................
1. Nobody is made to choose God or Satan, God cannot make us choose Him and He cannot make us choose Satan. We choose it, it is called FREEWILL.
2. When you choose yourself, your enjoyment of life more than your purpose in life (to make a positive impact in other peoples lives and become like Jesus in that impact),
you choose selfishness and hedonism more than selflessness, the pursuit of holiness, and choosing to know and do what you know is right and wrong; but have seared your consceince because you dont want to face that reality of being held accountable for your actions; by God, and mankind.
3. God chose to send Jesus down from Heaven, and use Him as your payment for sin; or the fact that no man or woman ever could measure up to moral perfection that God requires so Jesus was that perfection made manifest thru His life on earth.
4. When it comes to Jesus you have these 4 choices as to what you choose to accept about the truth of Jesus Christ's words
a. Jesus was a liar
b. Jesus was crazy
c. Jesus was a good teacher or prophet
d. Jesus was God the Son (Immanuel)"God with Us" and died willingly and rose again to take our place for our sin that we chose to commit, and defeat the sting of death once and for all all for all those who love, are in love with (agape) and trust as both Lord and Savior.
if you have any questions at all i would be glad to go over these truths with you, my email is Hispainismygain@yahoo.com

God's love be with you,
Eric Lee

Do you believe in God, Andrei? No. Neither do I. But that's a favorite question of mine. An upside-down question, you know. What do you mean? Well, if I asked people whether they believed in life, they'd never understand what I meant. It's a bad question. It can mean so much that it really means nothing. So I ask them if they believe in God. And if they say they do -- then, I know they don't believe in life. Why? Because, you see, God -- whatever anyone chooses to call God -- is one's highest conception of the highest possible. And whoever places his highest conception above his own possibility thinks very little of himself and his life. It's a rare gift, you know, to feel reverence for your own life and to want the best, the greatest, the highest possible, here, now, for your very own. -- We the Living by Ayn Rand
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mikehz

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #91 on: February 19, 2009, 11:09:09 PM »

The worse thing about the concept of gods is that some people believe in them. Then, they start getting their marching orders from a mythical being. What happens is their subconscious starts whispering to them, and they fantasize this to be the "voice of God." If they are in power, as Bush was or any number of Islamic fundamentalists are, or if they are the pope, they start issuing orders based on their imaginings, thinking it is actually God talking to them.

"What's that, God? You want me to launch the missiles? Oh, well--you're call!"
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"Force always attracts men of low morality." Albert Einstein

Sam Gunn (since nobody got Admiral Naismith)

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #92 on: February 19, 2009, 11:28:14 PM »

The worse thing about the concept of gods is that some people believe in them. Then, they start getting their marching orders from a mythical being. What happens is their subconscious starts whispering to them, and they fantasize this to be the "voice of God." If they are in power, as Bush was or any number of Islamic fundamentalists are, or if they are the pope, they start issuing orders based on their imaginings, thinking it is actually God talking to them.

"What's that, God? You want me to launch the missiles? Oh, well--you're call!"
Not necessarily.  There's plenty of people who believe in God and also do not believe that God "speaks to them"
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"Do not throw rocks at people with guns." —Hastings' Third Law
"Income tax returns are the most imaginative fiction being written today." —Herman Wouk 

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom." - Dwight D. Eisenhower

Shara

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #93 on: February 20, 2009, 12:38:52 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  That's in contrast to the organized Christian religions that aren't about being christlike at all.  That's the ultimate irony about Christianity, I don't think Jesus would have anything to do with it.

I think you're right on that ^
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Not much to say when you're high above the mucky-muck... yeah...

NHArticleTen

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #94 on: February 20, 2009, 08:51:33 AM »

I disagree with all except 1) and 4)b)


EDIT:

PS: I do not believe in Satan

the devil made you do it

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Rillion

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #95 on: February 20, 2009, 09:25:46 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so. 

Jesus also didn't play frisbee, own a dog, or have sex with a woman, nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  Do you think that means his followers should also refrain from such things in order to be consistent?
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Sam Gunn (since nobody got Admiral Naismith)

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #96 on: February 20, 2009, 10:06:11 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so. 

Jesus also didn't play frisbee, own a dog, or have sex with a woman, nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  Do you think that means his followers should also refrain from such things in order to be consistent?
Yes.
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"Do not throw rocks at people with guns." —Hastings' Third Law
"Income tax returns are the most imaginative fiction being written today." —Herman Wouk 

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom." - Dwight D. Eisenhower

NHArticleTen

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #97 on: February 20, 2009, 11:40:04 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so. 

Jesus also didn't play frisbee, own a dog, or have sex with a woman, nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  Do you think that means his followers should also refrain from such things in order to be consistent?

I saw him masturbate once or twice in a washroom in Juarez...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciudad_Ju%C3%A1rez

OH!?!  My Bad...you meant THAT one...

shit

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Ecolitan

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #98 on: February 20, 2009, 11:47:13 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so. 

Jesus also didn't play frisbee, own a dog, or have sex with a woman, nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  Do you think that means his followers should also refrain from such things in order to be consistent?

Jesus did specifically say that thing about throwing stones.  So he specifically said not to hurt people even if they do things you don't like.
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Rillion

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #99 on: February 20, 2009, 11:59:40 AM »

The WWJD crowd would all be libertarian if they were consistent, Jesus never initiated force on anyone nor did he recommend anyone else do so. 

Jesus also didn't play frisbee, own a dog, or have sex with a woman, nor did he recommend anyone else do so.  Do you think that means his followers should also refrain from such things in order to be consistent?

Jesus did specifically say that thing about throwing stones.  So he specifically said not to hurt people even if they do things you don't like.

Yes, and "that thing about throwing stones" is unworkable and therefore useless.   If nobody who has ever sinned should ever be allowed to judge that someone else has, then no justice system can ever exist and nobody can ever be punished for anything. 

Jesus also said to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's.  Not the most consistent guy, him. 
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Ecolitan

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #100 on: February 20, 2009, 12:03:25 PM »

Yes, and "that thing about throwing stones" is unworkable and therefore useless.   If nobody who has ever sinned should ever be allowed to judge that someone else has, then no justice system can ever exist and nobody can ever be punished for anything. 

Jesus also said to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's.  Not the most consistent guy, him. 

About the Caesar thing.  He never said what belonged to Ceasar.  There were Roman soldiers around, I would have been vague too. 

I'm all for no one being punished for anything.  Force should be about defense, not revenge.  It's not that big a deal for me, if you want to think Jesus was an evil fascist tyrant, that's OK w/ me.  I don't know you're wrong and no one really has any reliable reference at all cuz the bible isn't.
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Rillion

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #101 on: February 20, 2009, 12:33:34 PM »

I'm all for no one being punished for anything.  Force should be about defense, not revenge.

Jesus didn't advocate using force for defense, either.  Remember the "turning the other cheek" thing?

Quote
It's not that big a deal for me, if you want to think Jesus was an evil fascist tyrant, that's OK w/ me.  I don't know you're wrong and no one really has any reliable reference at all cuz the bible isn't.

I don't think Jesus as described in the bible was an "evil fascist tyrant."  I think he was a probably well-intentioned guy who was occasionally an asshole and threw around a lot of recycled platitudes that had already been done better by others before him.   Why anybody would want to emulate him aside from the whole son of God thing, I have no idea. 
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Ecolitan

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #102 on: February 20, 2009, 12:37:07 PM »

I'm all for no one being punished for anything.  Force should be about defense, not revenge.
Jesus didn't advocate using force for defense, either.  Remember the "turning the other cheek" thing?

I love it when people make my points for me :)
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Rillion

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #103 on: February 20, 2009, 12:45:08 PM »

I'm all for no one being punished for anything.  Force should be about defense, not revenge.
Jesus didn't advocate using force for defense, either.  Remember the "turning the other cheek" thing?

I love it when people make my points for me :)

If your point was that Jesus was inconsistent regarding when force is appropriate, then that point has certainly been made. 
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Ecolitan

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Re: Libertarianism and Religion
« Reply #104 on: February 20, 2009, 12:49:28 PM »

If your point was that Jesus was inconsistent regarding when force is appropriate, then that point has certainly been made. 

I can't believe I'm letting you pick a fight w/ me over evidence only available in a book neither of us finds reliable about the likely opinions of guy that may or may not have ever existed but, I'll bite, show me where he was inconsistent.

I gave a plausible explanation for the taxes thing.  That's off the table.
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