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Author Topic: Law of Attraction  (Read 90560 times)

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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #300 on: February 09, 2009, 12:35:41 PM »

My old view was, "there is no god".  My new one is, "we are god".  My prior lack of belief in a god wasn't a principle, just my view on life based upon my experiences up to that point.  My principle of nonagression has not been threatened at all by this new viewpoint.
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Rillion

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #301 on: February 09, 2009, 12:37:06 PM »

My old view was, "there is no god".  My new one is, "we are god".  My prior lack of belief in a god wasn't a principle, just my view on life based upon my experiences up to that point.  My principle of nonagression has not been threatened at all by this new viewpoint.

Please do one thing for me: define "god."
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Dylboz

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #302 on: February 09, 2009, 12:39:55 PM »

Well, say whatever you want about it's origin, it is a rejection of libertarianism, because there are no rights, there can be no moral judgments or evaluation of motives beyond base desires. The universe gives you what you want whether you realize it or not, and the entire universe is just the manifestation of the sum total of everyone's desires. Everything that happens is what has to happen because of what people's minds are doing, whether they were active or passive in bringing it about. All you can do is visualize this or that in hopes of manifesting it. Material desires, especially. And even if you are imagining something terrible, like rape or murder, or political power, that's not evil, because the universe will deliver unto you a willing victim! If that ain't sick...

Acquisitiveness mixed with new-age hocus pocus and some stale, millennia old religious mysticism, a dash of modern ego stroking and viola! The Secret!
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Dylboznia

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #303 on: February 09, 2009, 12:43:19 PM »

Well, say whatever you want about it's origin, it is a rejection of libertarianism, because there are no rights, there can be no moral judgments or evaluation of motives beyond base desires. The universe gives you what you want whether you realize it or not, and the entire universe is just the manifestation of the sum total of everyone's desires. Everything that happens is what has to happen because of what people's minds are doing, whether they were active or passive in bringing it about. All you can do is visualize this or that in hopes of manifesting it. Material desires, especially. And even if you are imagining something terrible, like rape or murder, or political power, that's not evil, because the universe will deliver unto you a willing victim! If that ain't sick...

Acquisitiveness mixed with new-age hocus pocus and some stale, millennia old religious mysticism, a dash of modern ego stroking and viola! The Secret!

Careful, you may raise the ghosts of Ayn Rand and Robert Heinlein to haunt Ian. :lol:
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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #304 on: February 09, 2009, 12:44:14 PM »

A rational world view, empiricism, the material basis for the universe, rejecting stories about supernatural sky fairies that grants wishes, etc. And by subscribing to this Secret crap, you actually have embraced an amoral, anti-rights philosophy, since the universe is delivering to people exactly what they want, so even when most libertarians would recognize a rights violation, Sam says they are getting what they want and/or deserve, since they either wanted it to happen, or did nothing to prevent it. That ain't any kind of libertarianism with which I am familiar.

It is a kind of materialistic hedonistic nihilism.

You haven't grasped the concept, and it's probably because we didn't do a good enough job explaining it or you weren't doing a good job listening.  Anyway, I'm not going to rehash it much detail here except to say: most people live life creating by default and the universe serves them up opportunities to achieve everything they believe they can have.  For many people, that's not much.  Those who live with the intention of creating the experience they want, will get that, as the universe serves them up the opportunities to achieve everything they believe they can have.  

You yell in defiant response to these ideas, "It's not rational or credible!  You can't have everything you want!" and the universe answers, "so shall it be".

If losing credibility with some atheists is the cost of my belief system, it's a small price to pay.   :lol:
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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #305 on: February 09, 2009, 12:45:05 PM »

My old view was, "there is no god".  My new one is, "we are god".  My prior lack of belief in a god wasn't a principle, just my view on life based upon my experiences up to that point.  My principle of nonagression has not been threatened at all by this new viewpoint.

Please do one thing for me: define "god."

All that is, has been, and shall ever be.
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Dylboz

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #306 on: February 09, 2009, 12:49:31 PM »

Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot... All gods! The universe served up some serious opportunities to these guys, who knew there were so many people who wanted to die in a bloody terror?
« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 12:51:13 PM by Dylboz »
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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #307 on: February 09, 2009, 12:50:17 PM »

Okay guess I should clarify.  I was attempting to soften my criticisms of Ian a little b/c I basically called him a fool in earlier posts (should I have?).  I do not idolize him as I do not idolize anyone...a close exception is my best friend who is also my wife.  My point I was trying to get across is simply that there are thousands of "us" that listen that now pity Ian regardless of whether or not he "wills" us not to b/c he is in a more "empowered" place.  I was attempting to show my caring side for the ideals I hold heroic, mainly logic and reason.   His beliefs are being 'attacked' and he is striking back defensively which is to be understood.  I think eventually something will either happen or click that will adjust his viewpoint to one that is logical.   That is if hubris doesn't overrule reason.  Clearly from his posts, that time is many moons from now.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 12:53:16 PM by parcgreene »
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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #308 on: February 09, 2009, 12:50:45 PM »

Well, say whatever you want about it's origin, it is a rejection of libertarianism, because there are no rights, there can be no moral judgments or evaluation of motives beyond base desires. The universe gives you what you want whether you realize it or not, and the entire universe is just the manifestation of the sum total of everyone's desires. Everything that happens is what has to happen because of what people's minds are doing, whether they were active or passive in bringing it about. All you can do is visualize this or that in hopes of manifesting it. Material desires, especially. And even if you are imagining something terrible, like rape or murder, or political power, that's not evil, because the universe will deliver unto you a willing victim! If that ain't sick...

Acquisitiveness mixed with new-age hocus pocus and some stale, millennia old religious mysticism, a dash of modern ego stroking and viola! The Secret!

The universe doesn't care about what you do.  To it, there is no right and wrong.

That is not to suggest that there should be no right and wrong to you.  In fact, you are here to define yourself based on your experience.  Experiencing evil allows you to choose good.  Were it not for wrong, how would you know what was right?  

So, please stop claiming that a pantheistic view is in any way a rejection of right and wrong.
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Dylboz

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #309 on: February 09, 2009, 12:54:03 PM »

So, please stop claiming that a pantheistic view is in any way a rejection of right and wrong.

But you just did! You have embraced moral relativism! To you, there is no right or wrong outside your own subjective internal experience, so what is right for Ian is not right for the cops, so you have no basis to criticize when they throw Barskey in jail! They view his open container and firearm as wrong, so they choose to do right by arresting him before he hurts anyone. Besides, he apparently got what he wanted anyway, an opportunity to get pinched and wind up in the slammer.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 12:59:01 PM by Dylboz »
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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #310 on: February 09, 2009, 01:03:01 PM »

My old view was, "there is no god".  My new one is, "we are god".  My prior lack of belief in a god wasn't a principle, just my view on life based upon my experiences up to that point.  My principle of nonagression has not been threatened at all by this new viewpoint.

Please do one thing for me: define "god."

All that is, has been, and shall ever be.

So we are all that is, has been, and ever shall be?   

You yell in defiant response to these ideas, "It's not rational or credible!  You can't have everything you want!" and the universe answers, "so shall it be".
The universe doesn't care about what you do.

These two statements are inconsistent.  Either the universe doesn't care what you do, or it grants your wishes.  Which is it?

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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #311 on: February 09, 2009, 01:18:31 PM »

So, please stop claiming that a pantheistic view is in any way a rejection of right and wrong.

But you just did! You have embraced moral relativism! To you, there is no right or wrong outside your own subjective internal experience, so what is right for Ian is not right for the cops, so you have no basis to criticize when they throw Barskey in jail! They view his open container and firearm as wrong, so they choose to do right by arresting him before he hurts anyone. Besides, he apparently got what he wanted anyway, an opportunity to get pinched and wind up in the slammer.

Huh?  Aren't your morals based on your logic and experience of what is right and wrong, or did you just accept what someone else told you is moral?
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FTL_Ian

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #312 on: February 09, 2009, 01:21:10 PM »

Please do one thing for me: define "god."
Quote

All that is, has been, and shall ever be.

So we are all that is, has been, and ever shall be?   

No, only a small portion of that.

Quote
You yell in defiant response to these ideas, "It's not rational or credible!  You can't have everything you want!" and the universe answers, "so shall it be".
The universe doesn't care about what you do.

These two statements are inconsistent.  Either the universe doesn't care what you do, or it grants your wishes.  Which is it?

Not at all.  I'm saying the universe doesn't judge you for your choices (as would some vengeful monotheistic god) and that it sets up the opportunities you need to create your intentions. 
« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 01:37:20 PM by FTL_Ian »
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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #313 on: February 09, 2009, 01:23:03 PM »

Ian do you have any suggested readings on the beliefs of pantheism?  Does LoA fit into the clearly defined pantheistic view?
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Rillion

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Re: Law of Attraction
« Reply #314 on: February 09, 2009, 01:28:41 PM »

So we are all that is, has been, and ever shall be?   

No, only a small portion of that.

But you said that we're god, and that's the definition you gave for god.  So you mean that we're part of all that is, has been, and ever shall be, and all of that is god? 

Second question-- everybody can agree that existence.....exists.  But what is the point of calling it "god"?  What's wrong with "existence"?

I'm saying the universe doesn't judge you for your choices (as would some vengeful monotheistic god) and that it sets up the opportunities you need to create your intentions. 

Everybody can agree that in the universe we can find opportunities.  What is the benefit of saying that the universe "sets up" opportunities?  In other words, what is the benefit of anthropomorphizing the universe? 
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