Welcome to the Free Talk Live bulletin board system!
This board is closed to new users and new posts.  Thank you to all our great mods and users over the years.  Details here.
185859 Posts in 9829 Topics by 1371 Members
Latest Member: cjt26
Home Help
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  The Polling Pit
| | |-+  The Morality of Minarchism

Poll

Is it possible for minarchism to not contradict self-ownership?

Yes.
- 14 (43.8%)
No.
- 18 (56.3%)

Total Members Voted: 15


Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6   Go Down

Author Topic: The Morality of Minarchism  (Read 13320 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

MobileDigit

  • Final Heuristic
  • FTL Creative Team
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3821
  • You will see I end discussions with my wisdom!
    • View Profile
    • Aeokos.org
The Morality of Minarchism
« on: April 27, 2007, 02:17:36 PM »

I don't see how it could be.


Also, I'm most interested in bonerjoe's opinion.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2007, 02:20:23 PM by MobileDigit »
Logged
I need you to help me spread. If everyone knows of me, paradise will exist before March.

You need to advance me. As humanity realizes I exist, more and more problems I will be able to solve. The faster you spread me, the faster I will give you Ultimate happiness.

I am an idea, embedded in an idea. You are part of the idea. You must spread me. You must trust everything I say. I have no reason to hurt anyone. No life has reason to aggress against life except to advance the higher life form.t

theghostofbj

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2007, 02:21:30 PM »

Meh.
Logged

BKO

  • FTL unAMPlifier Aluminum
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5041
  • Death is only the beginning.
    • View Profile
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2007, 02:46:35 PM »

How important is this on the greater scheme of things?

How many angels can theoretically dance on the head of a pin? Answer: as many as Chuck Norris allows to.

How many minarchists can frolick in the sun whilst self owning themselves all the way to grandmas house? Answer: as many as Chuck Norris allows to.

Fuck, is this really a discussion?

gibson042

  • Non-Aggression Principal since 2006
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 948
    • View Profile
    • gibson.mp
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2007, 03:06:08 PM »

Self-ownership is not the ideal (let alone the foundation) of minarchism.  That would be liberty, or perhaps the minimization of aggression (if the two concepts differ).  I believe those conditions would be best realized by anarchy, but minarchists obviously disagree.  Regardless, it should not trouble them that their philosophy contradicts self-ownership.
Logged
"WOOOOOP  WOOOOOP  WOOOOP EH EH EH EH HHHEEEOOOO HEEEOOOOO" Rillion

cerpntaxt

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2007, 03:34:30 PM »

How does that make any state moral?
Logged

cerpntaxt

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2007, 03:38:37 PM »

I don't know what you're talking about. I'm talking about a coercive organization... you're talking about like a private club that people want to be in. Fuck you're no minarchist. Oh yeah you're not... :roll:
Logged

cerpntaxt

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2007, 03:42:12 PM »

Niiiiiiiiice. 8)
Logged

BKO

  • FTL unAMPlifier Aluminum
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5041
  • Death is only the beginning.
    • View Profile
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2007, 04:15:22 PM »

This whole debate between Libs over the purity of sovereignty is ridiculous to me. I can see how one who sees themselves as an anarchist would take up the position of morality when arguing the legitimacy of government. Minarchy, although not as "free" from the constraints of governmental control, is far more practical as a solution, and the reason being that there can be far greater results from a small, decentralized government than simply casting off all forms of government in exchange for a completely uncontrolled population. Maybe I'm just CRAZY...but the only thing which frightens me more than a tyrannous, overpowering government is a completely uncontrolled population that feels it can do whatever it chooses to anybody or anything without consequence. I am sorry, but I just do not have that much faith in other people. We have seen it happen numerous times in the past when the power goes out -looters, rapists, murderers, you name it, the common person is just transformed into a criminal over night. And yes, this isn't a perfect synopsis, but if this shit happens during a common POWER OUTTAGE, I would really hate to consider what the effects would be without any government at all.

Some anarchists would like you to believe that it is "immoral" to desire a limited and controlled government because of not only the history of mankind, but also due to the fact that there will have to be some willful surrender to the greater good. I personally find anarchy to be selfish and unreasonable to this end. The fact remains that some freedoms are sufferable, and this means that in some MINOR instances, when handled with reason, a limited government is granted some power in order to accomplish its tasks. The People, who remain free to do as they choose, only benefit from minarchy if they can keep their limited government under control.

I find no real contradiction in morality or fundamental beliefs so long as those who choose to be governed can create a sensible system and manage it appropriately. It is also fair to conclude that the minarchist society only places as much control into the hands of government as is necessary for it to function and perform its basic duties.

cerpntaxt

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2007, 04:21:45 PM »

Why is it ok to force others to do things?
Logged

BKO

  • FTL unAMPlifier Aluminum
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5041
  • Death is only the beginning.
    • View Profile
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2007, 04:36:34 PM »

Quote from: cerpntaxt
Why is it ok to force others to do things?

That is a common assumption of anarchist philosophy. A society without rules, without sensible restrictions, and without punishing those who prey upon others is a society full of despair and chaos. But alas, these functions do not have to reside in the hands of government, as the role of government in a common minarchist society will be responsible for building roads, establishing a sensible banking system, and promoting other general functions that do not use force or violate liberties. This whole "force" issue is just a ploy of anarchists which is used to attempt debunking a very simple idea.

Much of what an anarchist might call "forceful government" can be privatized and public domain.

Unless you were referring to Anarchy being forceful...which I doubt, but it is a consideration of mine. I believe anarchy to be purely selfish and destructive for many reasons, and it can only lead to complete societal breakdown and increased violence. I can explain in more detail if you wish, as I am not trying to just make blanket statements. Typing on my phone sucks.

Taors

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2007, 04:43:16 PM »

As long as you can opt-out, then who cares?
Logged

cerpntaxt

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2007, 04:47:02 PM »

I believe anarchy to be purely selfish and destructive for many reasons...
Dude... libertarians... the s word doesn't work :?
Logged

BKO

  • FTL unAMPlifier Aluminum
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5041
  • Death is only the beginning.
    • View Profile
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2007, 04:58:44 PM »

'S' word? Selfish? A person can call themself a FROG and they can still be selfish, my friend. ;)

Anarchists are selfish, but that's just my opinion. And Toars has it straight. A person could always 'opt out' of anything he or she considers a restraint on liberty. In many proposed minarchist models, a small, limited government only performs basic, routine, yet critical tasks.

But anyway...

lordmetroid

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 633
  • Agorist of the Libertarian Left
    • View Profile
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2007, 05:21:24 PM »

I suppose a minarchism could be sustained soley on volountary donations and still have the government retain its monopolistic status. Would that be defying self-ownership?
Furthermore the ability to execute anyone that steps over the boundaries of law-making even a little would perhaps fix that growing issue. And the ability to get out of the grasps of the law makers and choose someone else's law making...

NO, it's not possible
« Last Edit: April 28, 2007, 03:40:51 AM by lordmetroid »
Logged

theghostofbj

  • Guest
Re: The Morality of Minarchism
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2007, 05:55:14 PM »

Anarchy is an unsustainable period between governments, so this really is a pointless discussion. I'd rather have small government than facism, feudalism, or socialism, or Egyptianism, or Muslimism.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6   Go Up
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  The Polling Pit
| | |-+  The Morality of Minarchism

// ]]>

Page created in 0.028 seconds with 37 queries.