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1726

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 06, 2006, 02:58:52 PM »

your rights to your landed property include a legal and monetary claim (backed by the state to enforce your title) on the wages of those you are excluding - how exactly is that libertarian?

This is the same collectivist - excuse me - common property argument you use elsewhere to say property is theft. If anyone wants to read through the very l-o-n-g diatribe anything I type will inspire, feel free to pop over to BenTucker's "Property is Theft" thread.

1727

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 06, 2006, 02:31:40 PM »

no those are from the social freedom side of the equation...I am specifically referring to the individualist anarchist tradition - the mutualists and georgists.

Not the georgists again. At least you included the mutualists this time. I followed the wikipedia recommended links at the bottom of the page, starting with Georgist. The choices become less & less attractive.
Georgist ---> Mutualist.
Mutualist ---> Socialist Economics.
Socialist Economics ---> Feminist Economics, Labour Economics, Marxist Economics.

well that is a utterly banal approach to a very important subject...

I could talk around it in an infinite spiral if you like. If the Georgist approach works for you, great. Set up your own system with like minded individuals - just don't expect me to agree that your mutual social club has any rights to my property.

1728

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 06, 2006, 01:53:10 PM »

no those are from the social freedom side of the equation...I am specifically referring to the individualist anarchist tradition - the mutualists and georgists.

Not the georgists again. At least you included the mutualists this time. I followed the wikipedia recommended links at the bottom of the page, starting with Georgist. The choices become less & less attractive.

Georgist ---> Mutualist.
Mutualist ---> Socialist Economics.
Socialist Economics ---> Feminist Economics, Labour Economics, Marxist Economics.

1729

General / Re: What is your best Liberty Quote?

« on: February 06, 2006, 09:08:03 AM »

Men fight for liberty and win it with hard knocks. 
Their children, brought up easy, let it slip away again, poor fools. 
And their grandchildren are once more slaves.  -D.H. Lawrence

Liberty means responsibility.  That is why most men dread it.  -George Bernard Shaw

"It is not for glory or riches or honours that we fight, but only for liberty, which no good man will consent to lose but with his life."
-The Declaration of Arbroath, Scotland's reply to Pope John XXII for excommunicating Robert Bruce, 1320 A.D.

1730

General / Re: What is your best Liberty Quote?

« on: February 06, 2006, 08:50:12 AM »

Here's an interesting source for a freedom/liberty quote - Franklin D. Roosevelt:

In the truest sense, freedom cannot be bestowed; it must be achieved.

1731

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 06, 2006, 12:01:27 AM »

Would you kill federal agents if they were trying to capture you?

Are we talking about agents who identify themselves as such and hand me the warrant? Because if they're from a secret division of an agency operating without a warrant, how do I know they're arresting me, and not just trying to kill or rob me? What uniforms do the secret police wear?

1732

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 05, 2006, 11:57:28 PM »

Sad to say right now I'd probably only go up to about 6. I'm not sure if anything more would have public support yet. If we don't have some general support or sympathy and can't generate it, we should probably either move to NH and then secede or just leave the country altogether. Anything else would be a losing battle. It would mean that the rest of the USA doesnt want to be free and no amount of fighting will change that.

Each individual needs to be clear on their motives - a desparate attempt to protect their personal property and liberty - or the start of of a revolution.

Much of the rest of the USA does NOT want to be free. Republicrats agree with freedom either economic OR social/morality issues. Agreeing with principles of liberty on 20% of issues is meaningless if you're willing to use government to enforce the other 80%, whether you're left or right. From what I understand, it was only a very small percentage of colonists who seriously supported the freedom movement that was the American Revolution. So what support or sympathy do you need to see in order to act?

And, if ya'll do decide to move, where would you go if not NH? Which country? Somewhere among the EU nations? Big Brother England? France? The economic freedom index is wonderful, but Singapore and Indonesia execute for drug possession. Australia, NZ & Canada are struggling under massive social programs. Hong Kong has been raising tax rates, and is now subject to China, which is not known for Free Speech.

Is going to another country really better than working for change here?

1733

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 05, 2006, 10:33:16 PM »

So on a scale of 1-9, how far would each of you go?

And, how would you answer your question?

1734

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 05, 2006, 09:25:20 PM »

As Badnarik rightly points out, there are no "Constitutional rights."  The Bill of Rights grants nothing to us, only enumerates a handful of the rights we have whether or not they are written down.  An amendment could be passed (legitimately or not, as history has shown us on more than one occasion) that, for example, repeals the Second Amendment.  This would not deprive us of our right to keep and bear arms.  It would only signal the government's refusal to recognize our right.  If that were to happen, we must continue to exercise the right, regardless of their recognition of it.  The same goes for any right, including those not enumerated in the Constitution.

Point taken. How about "natural rights, which the constitution was supposedly written to protect"?

1735

General / Re: Activism: how far would you go?

« on: February 05, 2006, 09:11:45 PM »

How many laws and or regulations do each of us break or skirt around every week? Is anyone on this BBS able to say with absolute certainty that he or she hasn't broken any? Our government has put so many caveats on our daily activities at all levels, that it's hard to say.

I'm not saying we should go out and start throwing rocks with politcal messages through govt. office buildings, or initiate force.
But I think we have to be willing to openly break the law, when the law is a flat-out violation of constitutionally protected rights.
The homeowners in condemnation/eminent domain cases should sit on their front steps and wait to be dragged from their property and arrested.
Badnarik was right to walk into the barricades outside the presidential debate and be arrested.
Doctors who assist patients end their suffering either by prescribing pills they know to be for the purpose of an overdose or administering a higher dose of morphine by injection do so knowing that they are in danger of arrest AND losing their license to practice their profession, yet they choose to do what is right for their patient.

I'm not sure exactly how far I would go, or exactly where to begin. I do know that as my children get older and are more self-reliant, I will be willing to step farther.  America's founders started with arguments over the pub table, letters to newspapers, pamphlets and books. It wasn't until they began to act openly that things began to change.

1736

General / Re: Bored and stuck in school-Help!

« on: January 28, 2006, 12:40:48 PM »

Start planning to attend college in NH? Gives you a goal on which to focus, that whole light at the end of the tunnel thing. That should help a bit with boredom & frustration.

Plus, gives you the opportunity to talk up liberatrian principles & the free state project when discussing after HS plans with other kids, teachers & your parents. Because you know, the question will come up time and time again "Why New Hampshire?"

1737

General / Intro to Libertarianism - mp3 from Auburn U. Libertarians/Mises Institute

« on: January 26, 2006, 02:21:55 PM »

Dr. Mark Thornton from the Mises Institute spoke to the Auburn University Libertarians earlier this month. He gave a 30 minute "Introduction to Libertarianism", starting with his introduction to the philosophy and party as a college student.
This would be great to pass along to a friend who leans Libertarian, but doesn't quite get it yet. It's very easy to listen to. Dr. Thornton does a great job relating Libertarian ideals to current situations. AUL has a link to the mp3 on their news page, or you can go to:
http://www.mises.org/multimedia/mp3/Thornton-01-19-2006.mp3

The Mises Institute also has many of their past programs & lectures available on their media page.

1738

General / Re: Shrine FAQ

« on: January 19, 2006, 09:42:09 PM »

The question is completely about size & file type. Not photo content....

Thanks.

1739

General / Re: Shrine FAQ

« on: January 19, 2006, 09:15:17 PM »

What are the file requirements for submission of photos?

1740

General / Re: Ian is this your new girlfriend?

« on: January 17, 2006, 05:02:15 PM »

Julia,

Since the boys seem to think they are all still in middle school, where they have to pick on Ian for getting a smile from a pretty girl, maybe you can tape "kick me" signs on them.