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The Free Talk Live BBS
Profile of dalebert
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18
General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: November 07, 2014, 08:32:48 AM »
So how is the corporation getting a good deal for it's taxes when they're funding services that benefit everyone and not just the corporations who paid for it, like fire stations? That just seems like a basic math failure. That actually raises a question. What exactly is the corporation getting for its taxes in this theoretical situation of a non-corrupt, non-aggressive government? Presumably it's not benefiting from eminent domain or oppressive regulations on its competitors, right?
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General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: November 06, 2014, 10:39:41 AM »
I understand Sean's skepticism completely. Right now, the benefits corporations gain for their taxes involve lots of violence. A couple of examples that come to mind are suppressing competition with various regulations and paperwork requirements that are daunting to smaller businesses and eminent domain to steal land and sell it to corporations at rock bottom prices. And maybe you have other benefits in mind that are less rights-violating but that's kind of what governments tend to do--violate rights. My belief is that people are generally looking out for their self interest and governments are unaccountable for their actions so it's a disaster when we give special rights and effectively consolidate power into a small group of people.
Not a hard proof you're wrong. It's just why I think it's kind of a fantasy to think you have figured out a way for people to get "free" stuff through governments.
Not a hard proof you're wrong. It's just why I think it's kind of a fantasy to think you have figured out a way for people to get "free" stuff through governments.
21
General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: November 04, 2014, 10:51:06 AM »
As long as you're talking about government-recognized corporations in that specific context in which they do get special benefits from the state via their "legal fiction" status, then I don't really have beef with you about that. I agree that large companies (not necessarily just corporations but them too) get lots of benefits for the taxes they pay. It's actually a smart investment for Walmart to lobby the government to kick people off their private property rather than buy it on an open market on the premise that the government will collect a lot of taxes from them, taxes they're going to pay anyway so they may as well benefit from government force.
That said, the basic idea of people pooling their investments into one endeavor and divvying it up into property shares based on how much they've invested is just a (albeit complex) contract and doesn't justify them being stolen from. If someone did an agorist version of a corporation, that would be very different and I wouldn't wish violence upon them for it.
That said, the basic idea of people pooling their investments into one endeavor and divvying it up into property shares based on how much they've invested is just a (albeit complex) contract and doesn't justify them being stolen from. If someone did an agorist version of a corporation, that would be very different and I wouldn't wish violence upon them for it.
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General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: November 03, 2014, 12:28:51 PM »
It's really just a contract. It's people investing to own a portion of the proceeds that an endeavor produces. I'm not sure what YOU mean by a legal fiction. Maybe you can clarify. But contracts are very libertarian and simply represent clear terms for a voluntary agreement between people. The forming of a corporation might be a bit more complicated, but absent government and the whatever special benefits that governments decide to give corporations, a corporation is just an elaborate contract for collaboration of resources and efforts.
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General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: October 29, 2014, 11:44:04 AM »
At its core, a corporation is just people working together for common goals. As they exist now, they make deals with government for special benefits and therein lies the problem. In a stateless society, they are just people doing stuff together. They have no more rights than individuals and no fewer.
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General / Re: want to fund government without any "stealing" so gov can build a fire station ?
« on: October 27, 2014, 09:04:59 PM »
Walmart has reading glasses for like $2.
