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1396

The Polling Pit / Re: DO RIGHTS EXIST?

« on: August 11, 2006, 02:16:04 PM »

Natural rights are rights that cannot be taken away under any circumstances whatsoever.  Such as the right to free speech--no government can ever force you to hold your tongue (until they figure out some drug or medical procedure to do so) no matter how many laws they pass, they can only provide a strong incentive through physical coersion to do so...

they most certainly can if you are infringing on the equal right of others...

If you do not have the right to infringe on the equal rights of others than preventing you from doing so is not taking away your rights at all. 

I think what he's trying to say here is that you can be imprisoned for exercising your right to free speech but that doesn't mean that you don't have the right to it.  Someone choosing to physically prevent you from exercising your rights doesn't mean that the right doesn't exist. 

1397

The Polling Pit / Re: DO RIGHTS EXIST?

« on: August 11, 2006, 12:35:01 PM »

I've been working on an essay about this.  I don't see a way that one can say that the recognition of natural rights/self-ownership can be explained w/o religion of some sort.  Animals don't recognize unalienable rights.  If man is just a highly developed animal than we wouldn't have any rights that they do not.  I've heard that man is different because he can reason but I can't prove that man alone has the ability to reason.  Even if that's true I don't see where a biological function of the brain is any better reason to extrapolate the right to self-ownership than opposable thumbs or lungs. 

I'd really like to hear what Ian thinks about it as an atheist.  He's clearly principled in that he believes that a person has no right to initiate force on another person....period.  I agree whole-heartedly but I can't make a rational argument to prove it based on the assumption that the world is exactly as it appears to the 5 senses and man is merely a highly developed primate.  I also don't subscribe to any organized religion but recognize my "belief" that man has a right to own himself and to deny him that right is "morally wrong" is not a product of rational extrapolation of physical evidence but rather a firm conviction that is based on nothing but a religious faith in NAP/ZAP.

1398

General / Re: FSP and FTL activism at Vans Warped Tour

« on: July 26, 2006, 09:43:16 PM »

St. Louis:
http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=11680.msg159438#msg159438

Thanks to Manwhich for the "that's so violent" approach.

Some guy told me he liked the nanny state and I said: "How do you feel about violence"

That progressed to the point of me saying: "What's not violent about handcuffing me and locking me in a tiny cell against my will and depriving me of my family?"  He had no answer

Edit:  I forgot to mention.  We're still writing FreeTalkLive.com in the matchbooks and handing out FTL flyers.  One person promised to call the show and explain to we misguided libertarians that because smoking causes cancer, smokers should give the government money. 

1399

General / Re: Tower of Babel

« on: July 21, 2006, 09:21:06 PM »

Quote from: janepuke

1400

General / Re: Flex your Rights - BUSTED! Video

« on: July 01, 2006, 11:30:03 AM »

A guy (not me) at PorcFest had a GIANT bug chock-full of red hairs. He said he found a connection within a few days of moving in-state. It all depends on who you talk to, I guess!

It was god weed and it was easy enough to come across that it found me.  Just more expensive than Oklahoma.  Which is to be expected.

1401

General / Re: FCC Monkey-Wrenching Project : Go!

« on: June 28, 2006, 08:18:11 AM »

I know I'm probably in the minority here, but I'm not sure this is such a great idea. It is kind of an entertaining and creative idea. I just think the bureaucrats waste enough time on their own without us creating more work that we ultimately will have to pay for.

You're not alone.  I'm both entertained and concerned.  I don't like using FTL resources for this.

1402

General / Re: Monkey-wrenching the FCC complaint form...

« on: June 21, 2006, 05:34:43 AM »

I hear they aired something the other day about banning flag burning.  Should we really allow such an anti-freedom message to be broadcast to our children. 

1403

General / Re: Monkey-wrenching the FCC complaint form...

« on: June 20, 2006, 08:58:26 PM »

Yesterday I saw a HUGE woman in a bikini on Oprah.  I was at a public place so had no control over what was on the TV.  I really wish I had never been subjected to that. 

1404

General / Re: FSP and FTL activism at Vans Warped Tour

« on: June 20, 2006, 02:45:39 PM »

I worked the Kansas City show yesterday.  We signed up 4 FSP members and handed out a lot of FSP and FTL fliers.
Our biggest giveaway item were our FSP matchbooks so we wrote something about Free Talk Live inside all of them. 


Matchbooks
[img=http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9537/dsc01193small7rg.th.jpg]


The Booth 1 hour before showtime.
[img=http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/1603/dsc011876cn.th.jpg]


Lisa talking about the FSP and picking out literature.
[img=http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/5523/dsc012033qk.th.jpg]

1405

General / Re: Great news for liberty lovers! Somalia anarchy becoming more peaceful.

« on: June 12, 2006, 12:16:59 PM »

That was great!   The CNN articles I've read say that the US is backing the warlords.  The reporter did a good job just going with it when she discovered both of her guests were against the warlords. 

1406

General / Re: Tower of Babel

« on: June 09, 2006, 09:10:11 PM »

Quote from: janepuke

1407

General / Re: The LP's New Web Site

« on: June 06, 2006, 01:33:39 PM »

Why?  The vast majority of libertarians are not and have never been members of the Libertarian Party.  Maybe you should drop out of the LP and stop calling yourself a LP member if you disagree with the LP but what does that have to do with libertarianism (a ideology that claims many more members of the GOP or Democratic Party then the LP does).

I'm not a member of the LP.  Never have been unless checking libertarian on voter registration makes you a member but even then you can no longer register libertarian in OK and we've all been switched to "independent".

However to the vast majority of people the LP defines the word "libertarian".  If I didn't take into consideration the popular perception of a word before I used it I would be very likely to miscommunicate with most everyone I encountered.  I would also just call myself a "liberal" like Thomas Jefferson, John Locke, and Adam Smith.  But if I did call myself a liberal people would think of Hillary Clinton and LBJ which would be miscommunication of on a grand scale.

1408

General / Re: Tag over gang tags

« on: June 06, 2006, 10:00:39 AM »

Canada has a clause in their constitution that says you can't punish someone unless you can proved that they have caused harm.  David Malmo Levine used it in his defense for trafficking marijuana.  He lost at the supreme court level 6-3.

1409

General / Re: Tag over gang tags

« on: June 06, 2006, 12:34:26 AM »

That's why we need a no harm clause like Canada.

1410

General / Re: The LP's New Web Site

« on: June 02, 2006, 08:34:43 PM »

I didn't pay much attention to the old site and I won't pay much attention to this one.  I did, however go searching for a statement of principles and found this:

"I"n a sense, Libertarians “borrow” from both sides to come up with a logical and consistent whole -- but without the exceptions and broken promises of Republican and Democratic politicians. That's why we call ourselves the Party of Principle.

That's it.  I'm afraid the idea of liberty predated both parties.  I didn't borrow from either of them.  I think I might cease identifying myself as a libertarian.