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Author Topic: HILARY08!!!!!  (Read 21465 times)

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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #30 on: November 18, 2007, 05:48:15 PM »

Quote
Yes they are different but the further you go into socialism the closer you get to communism.  Hilarys views are in that direction and opposite of mine, hence the idea of this post.  I dont like where socialism goes, hence the point Im making.

Communism is the abolition of property, wealth and status in favor of making all things universal. Socialism is the more equitable sharing of these things. They are VERY different from each other.

I dont see them so different.

"The goal of socialism is communism" -Viadimir Lenin.

Yes it is. How does this mean that they are equivalent?

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JKMP

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #31 on: November 18, 2007, 05:52:09 PM »

Quote
Yes they are different but the further you go into socialism the closer you get to communism.  Hilarys views are in that direction and opposite of mine, hence the idea of this post.  I dont like where socialism goes, hence the point Im making.

Communism is the abolition of property, wealth and status in favor of making all things universal. Socialism is the more equitable sharing of these things. They are VERY different from each other.

I dont see them so different.

"The goal of socialism is communism" -Viadimir Lenin.

Yes it is. How does this mean that they are equivalent?



I have been informed by multiple sources that you are a dumbass who excretes bullshit orally.
I have decided not to fuel your drivel.

I end with this.


you are a commie.
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #32 on: November 18, 2007, 06:05:44 PM »

I take your petty insults as an admission of the fact that you really don't know anything about communism.
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #33 on: November 18, 2007, 08:31:33 PM »

I take your petty insults as an admission of the fact that you really don't know anything about communism.

Oh shut the fuck up, Mao Zedong! Put on your box rimmed EMO glasses, your Che shirt, and shove a dildo up your ass while playing the hymn of the USSR.

The fact that understanding something before rejecting it is completely foreign to you speaks volumes.
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Phant

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #34 on: November 19, 2007, 08:42:51 PM »

The fact that understanding something before rejecting it is completely foreign to you speaks volumes.

No, it doesn't.

There are millions of products for sale online, from Anglo-Saxon manuscripts to airplane parts, many of which I'm not familiar with and won't know what to do with.  The fact that I don't want to buy them even though I don't understand them does not make me ignorant.  The same applies to whatever government programs you want to buy with my money.  No deal.
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #35 on: November 19, 2007, 08:47:30 PM »

The fact that understanding something before rejecting it is completely foreign to you speaks volumes.

No, it doesn't.

There are millions of products for sale online, from Anglo-Saxon manuscripts to airplane parts, many of which I'm not familiar with and won't know what to do with.  The fact that I don't want to buy them even though I don't understand them does not make me ignorant.  The same applies to whatever government programs you want to buy with my money.  No deal.


Not buying something isn't rejecting it. Hating those plane parts like JKMP hates communism without understanding it is beyond ignorance, it is prejudice.
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JKMP

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #36 on: November 19, 2007, 08:59:41 PM »

The fact that understanding something before rejecting it is completely foreign to you speaks volumes.

No, it doesn't.

There are millions of products for sale online, from Anglo-Saxon manuscripts to airplane parts, many of which I'm not familiar with and won't know what to do with.  The fact that I don't want to buy them even though I don't understand them does not make me ignorant.  The same applies to whatever government programs you want to buy with my money.  No deal.


Not buying something isn't rejecting it. Hating those plane parts like JKMP hates communism without understanding it is beyond ignorance, it is prejudice.
I never said I hated it, It is against the constitution and what I want to see my country become, I think it would lead to more coruption than we already have.  I dont think socialist or communist programs or laws will take this country in the direction it needs to go.

youve repeatedly said Im misunderstanding communism. Fine, I dont think I am.

Explain your point. Prove me wrong... no, better yet. Educate me on how communism(or socialism your choice) will help put this country back on track.
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #37 on: November 19, 2007, 09:09:13 PM »

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I never said I hated it, It is against the constitution and what I want to see my country become, I think it would lead to more coruption than we already have.  I dont think socialist or communist programs or laws will take this country in the direction it needs to go.

Right, but you don't understand it so you have no basis on which to make that claim.
Quote
Explain your point. Prove me wrong... no, better yet. Educate me on how communism(or socialism your choice) will help put this country back on track.

I won't argue that point, but you misunderstand what communism is. I can't explain the entire system to you, you will have to study the works of Marx to grasp that concept. I can elucidate the difference between socialism and communism though-

Socialism is the equitable distribution of wealth via the government

Communism is the abolition of property, money, and social classes in order to allow men to self actualize (do all of the things that they see fit, be it painting, carving, making cars, etc) via free conscious production, and to act in concert to produce more than is possible in any other society, thus producing a utopia based on logic, reason, and brotherhood, without gods, countries, property or forced labor to create divisions between men.
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Phant

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #38 on: November 19, 2007, 09:09:22 PM »

Not buying something isn't rejecting it. Hating those plane parts like JKMP hates communism without understanding it is beyond ignorance, it is prejudice.

I do hate communism for many reasons, not the least of which is what it did to three generations of my family.  But I'm not saying I want to seek it out and destroy it wherever it may hide - quite to the contrary, I am highly critical of all efforts to do so, from even before Nam to Chavez in 2002.  Communist regimes collapse a lot faster when they can't blame the CIA for their misery.  And suppressing their free speech only gives idiots like yourself credibility.

Socialism is the equitable distribution of wealth via the government

In other words, armed robbery from the producers of wealth to the mob of your political supporters.

Communism is the abolition of property, money, and social classes in order to allow men to self actualize (do all of the things that they see fit, be it painting, carving, making cars, etc) via free conscious production, and to act in concert to produce more than is possible in any other society, thus producing a utopia based on logic, reason, and brotherhood, without gods, countries, property or forced labor to create divisions between men.

You can abolish your own property and money if that's what you want, reject whatever classes you see yourself having belonged to, and self-actualize until your balls glow in the dark, but don't expect me to pay your bills while you're doing so.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2007, 09:20:28 PM by Phant »
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JKMP

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #39 on: November 19, 2007, 09:20:56 PM »

Communism is the abolition of property, money, and social classes in order to allow men to self actualize (do all of the things that they see fit, be it painting, carving, making cars, etc) via free conscious production, and to act in concert to produce more than is possible in any other society, thus producing a utopia based on logic, reason, and brotherhood, without gods, countries, property or forced labor to create divisions between men.
and that will work like it dide in cambodia? or mabye russia? what about cuba?
I understand all that.  I dont think its possible in our society or in any to maintain it.  I think it goes against mans natural insticts.  I dont think a "utopia" is possible outside fiction.

I think socialist (which lets say are closer to communist than we are now but they are not the same.) programs that try to bring everyone equal whatever (healthcare, income, whatever) put more government into power.

I see more government as a problem

I get it. You dont see it as that bad.

To be honest I thought you knew somthing I didnt... disapointed me man..
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #40 on: November 19, 2007, 10:20:46 PM »

Quote
You can abolish your own property and money if that's what you want, reject whatever classes you see yourself having belonged to, and self-actualize until your balls glow in the dark, but don't expect me to pay your bills while you're doing so.

I see the problem now. You can't separate learning about something from advocating something. That's a very unhealthy belief to hold.

Quote
I understand all that.  I dont think its possible in our society or in any to maintain it.  I think it goes against mans natural insticts.  I dont think a "utopia" is possible outside fiction.

No, you don't understand all of that because you couldn't differentiate communism from socialism until I explained it to you. Even my rudimentary explanation leaves you in the dark about most of the theory and philosophy of communism. I just want you to better grasp the philosophy before you out and out reject it.

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JKMP

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #41 on: November 19, 2007, 10:34:30 PM »

Quote from: EricfromMI link=topic=17856.msg3339
I see the problem now. You can't separate learning about something from advocating something. That's a very unhealthy belief to hold.


you gonna nitpick or you gonna tell me if you think its good for our country?

If it will make the USA a utopia.
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Phant

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #42 on: November 19, 2007, 11:21:38 PM »

I see the problem now. You can't separate learning about something from advocating something. That's a very unhealthy belief to hold.

You "learn" about something by mindlessly parroting its propaganda?  Good thing you're not "learning" about ancient Mesopotamia, or you'd be trolling the NASA forums ranting about how the giant turtle on whose back the flat earth is rested will eat us if we don't pay homage to the high priest!

(Or something like that.)
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EricfromMI

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #43 on: November 19, 2007, 11:39:28 PM »

Quote from: EricfromMI link=topic=17856.msg3339
I see the problem now. You can't separate learning about something from advocating something. That's a very unhealthy belief to hold.


you gonna nitpick or you gonna tell me if you think its good for our country?

If it will make the USA a utopia.

As someone who has studied communism, I don't think it is tenable. Same goes for anarchocapitalism, in my opinion.

Quote
You "learn" about something by mindlessly parroting its propaganda?  Good thing you're not "learning" about ancient Mesopotamia, or you'd be trolling the NASA forums ranting about how the giant turtle on whose back the flat earth is rested will eat us if we don't pay homage to the high priest!

God you missed the point by fucking a mile. Modern communism was defined by a single man, Marx. It was redefined multiple times by multiple men, but to understand communism you must understand Marx. You don't study communist theory by studying the effects of revisionist communism under Mao or Stalin for instance.
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Phant

  • Guest
Re: HILARY08!!!!!
« Reply #44 on: November 20, 2007, 01:51:42 AM »

Maybe I should also limit my study of history to the writings of Herodotus?
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