Welcome to the Free Talk Live bulletin board system!
This board is closed to new users and new posts.  Thank you to all our great mods and users over the years.  Details here.
185859 Posts in 9829 Topics by 1371 Members
Latest Member: cjt26
Home Help
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  General
| | |-+  Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?  (Read 4013 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Kelvin

  • FTL AMPlifier Silver
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 66
    • View Profile
Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« on: May 06, 2012, 10:39:17 PM »

This will be my first Porcfest.  After hearing all the stories, I just have to go.

But it looks as if the dark clouds of state regulation may be on the horizon....  It appears that they are banning alcohol sales this year.  See the section with the heading

Vendor Notes:

http://happyporcupine.info/agoravalley/

Do they always say this as a CYA, (wink wink nudge nudge)  in order to maintain plausible deniability if there are issues with Agents of the State?  Or is this the first of restrictions to come.  The Rodgers Campground people are after all the property owners and we would have to agree in principle that they have the right to set the rules.

I mean, I just want to get beer from a 9 year old girl, like the NPR guys did....

Maybe that will be a way around the restriction.  It says no "sales".  Maybe you can give it as a free bonus when you buy one of these here special poker chips or something.

What say you all?

-Kelvin
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 10:55:16 PM by Kelvin »
Logged
==============================
"It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds."

-Samuel Adams

sillyperson

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5196
  • Free the Mallocs!
    • View Profile
    • NH Liberty Alliance
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2012, 08:20:08 AM »

Last PorcFest was organized by irresponsible persons, and much irresponsibility was the predictable result.
Thank the various Gods, this year some extremely responsible people have stepped up to the plate. The upshot is that PF will continue into the forseeable future.

See, it's fucking dumbass to put up a big banner that says, "illegal alcohol sold here! FOAD, pigs!!" because that leave law enforcement -- even sympathetic LE -- with no choice, really.
Contrast that with responsible, quiet, under-the-table, out-of-sight activities. Plausible deniability. No need for big drama.

Osborne

  • Worshipful Grand Conspirator
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1241
    • View Profile
    • Sakal/CAI
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2012, 11:00:03 AM »


It may be the end of PorcFest if folks fail to heed the request of the property owner to not be flaunting their illegal activities.

Rest assured that more than enough booze found its way to PorcFest before last year, with no giant signage advertising sales.
Logged

Sovereign Curtis

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 131
    • View Profile
    • http://porcfest.com
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2012, 01:35:43 PM »

Last PorcFest was organized by irresponsible persons, and much irresponsibility was the predictable result.
Thank the various Gods, this year some extremely responsible people have stepped up to the plate. The upshot is that PF will continue into the forseeable future.

ಠ_ಠ

Irresponsible personS? Well considering this year's team is basically last year's team minus yours truly, then this year's team must be irresponsible, as well.
Logged

GrossObeseBugEyed

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 13
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2012, 03:12:11 PM »

Yeah. I have high hopes for this year's PF because of the people running it this year. Last year was just, well, irresponsible pretty much hit the nail on the head. Im staying positive this year though.
Logged

Sovereign Curtis

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 131
    • View Profile
    • http://porcfest.com
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2012, 09:47:03 PM »

Irresponsible how?
Logged

sillyperson

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5196
  • Free the Mallocs!
    • View Profile
    • NH Liberty Alliance
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2012, 09:51:31 AM »

Irresponsible how?
Um, the organizer taking hits of pot while giving media interviews, that pretty much sums it up. +10 points for libertarian "I don't give a shit" cool factor; minus several million for common sense.

Letting, no, encouraging vendors to advertise that they're selling illegal booze. It just screams, "please let there be massive drama as the cops come in and shut the whole thing down"


Don't take it personally, Curtis, okay? You're making good progress.


I, for one, welcome our new Sakal overlords.

GrossObeseBugEyed

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 13
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2012, 04:53:20 AM »

The comment above me is pretty much what I think on the situation.

Curtis, you ARE making progress. But you need to be more responsible.
Logged

Laetitia

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3952
  • ...
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2012, 08:57:47 AM »

I, for one, welcome our new Sakal overlords.

The schedule is looking quite good with the new organization. Something for everyone.

My whole family is looking forward to Porcfest this year. My youngest is excited about crafting with Mel and several of the kid activities; my older two have already figured out which table games they're bringing. Pretty sure my husband is thinking mostly of the woven bacon he heard about on NPR.

We've been locked into visiting family with each vacation over the last several years, but declared this summer to be a year when we're doing exactly what we want... camping with the porcupines in NH again :)

Logged
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of experience comes from bad judgment.

edmnd

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2012, 10:51:46 AM »

Private campground. Couldn't care less about their rules but I respect them.
If they became too burdensome, lobby to move the event next year.
Little bit of arithmetic will show the blow that is.
That's how shit works in voluntary societies that respects private property, isn't it?

Besides, porcfest is going to end sometime. But it's happening this year. Enjoy it.

Driving up from North Alabama and dragging a friend from AZ. Mostly just to check out NH and sleep under the stars for a few nights. Excited but still really on the fence about the whole thing. Any case, I've already dropped the cash so come hell or high water I'll be driving 20+ hrs to sleep in my leaky child size Walmart tent, pick deer ticks with Lyme disease off my groin, drink warm cheap beer and meet cool people.
Logged
"No man can put a chain about the ankle of his fellow man without at last finding the other end fastened about his own neck." Frederick Douglass - Speech at Civil Rights Mass Meeting, Washington, D.C.

Bill Brasky

  • Emperor of Wisdom
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 553
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2012, 03:00:27 AM »

Private campground. Couldn't care less about their rules but I respect them.
If they became too burdensome, lobby to move the event next year.
Little bit of arithmetic will show the blow that is.
That's how shit works in voluntary societies that respects private property, isn't it?

Heres the problem, in a nut shell, in regard to alcohol..

Even though its private property, the public is invited.  That makes it a public event, basically.

At a public event, it is necessary to purchase a temporary beer/liquor permit.  (most likely just a beer permit, for simplicity, which is what you see at a bizarre or fair).

These permits must go into someone's name, who is then responsible for the distribution.  Carding to prevent minors, cataloging the amount sold, probably paying sales tax per vend, all sorts of clerical horseshit.  You are also then liable if someone wrecks their car and kills someone, because you sold them, maybe they were visibly intoxicated...  Theres a lot to it.

To prevent the trouble of the variety of lunkheads that may fuck the dog, the owner simply denies the sale of beer on his premises.  He could have insurance issues with this, as well.

If you put it on actual private property, it's probably not feasible to have all the necessary hookups for utilities, toilet facilities, and the property owner still has the issue of insurance liability.  Its a trade-off.  You could sell tickets to get into a "private party", charge for cups or whatever, but the venue location itself would probably suck major ass.

The simplest solution is to just BYOB, abide the rules of the campground, and everybody's happy.  How hard is it to bring your own fucking booze, y'know?  Not hard at all.  Its a non-issue.

People who can't wrap their head around that, and make a big kerfuffle about the alcohol sales thing don't understand dick, probably shouldn't be there in the first place.

...which is why some people are raising holy hell about the illicit advertised sales last year, and other people just don't "get it".  It was a direct slap in Rogers face, and very uncool in my opinion. 

If you wanna "help a brother out", and sell him a few cans out of your stash, great.  Nobody has an issue with that.  But if you truck in a couple kegs and just start sellin' fuckin' beers willy-nilly, I'm sorry, but you're a dumb reckless dick with no respect for a mans hard-earned property, and his gracious invitation for you to be on it.









Logged

edmnd

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2012, 09:17:31 PM »

Thanks for pointing all that out. I obviously missed the nuances of the original post. BYOB policy certainly doesn't seem unreasonable. Necessary precautions to keep someone from activities that allow a pond scum level state attorney from fleecing the property owner are okay with me.
Logged
"No man can put a chain about the ankle of his fellow man without at last finding the other end fastened about his own neck." Frederick Douglass - Speech at Civil Rights Mass Meeting, Washington, D.C.

One two three

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3650
    • View Profile
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2012, 09:40:56 PM »

This will be my first Porcfest.  After hearing all the stories, I just have to go.

But it looks as if the dark clouds of state regulation may be on the horizon....  It appears that they are banning alcohol sales this year.

I've bought beer at Roger's before.  As far as I know, Roger's still sells beer.  As for alcohol sales by others at Roger's, that's always been illegal.
Logged
Why New Hampshire?  Learn why 1000s of liberty activists are planning to move to NH.  See the debate in page after page of forum messages, http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?124976-101-Reasons-to-move-to-New-Hampshire

FTL_Ian

  • Professional Iconoclast
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 10446
    • View Profile
    • Free Keene
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2012, 03:34:58 PM »

The fucked up thing is that even giving away beer to someone is a felony in NH.  At least that's what Brad Jardis told me.  So, therefore any giving away or accepting "donations" or selling a pencil and giving a free beer, or anything EXCEPT each individual buying beer from a licensed vendor is a felony. 

It's insane.
Logged
Please support the show by joining the AMP program at http//amp.freetalklive.com

I blog at http://freekeene.com

Highline

  • FTL AMPlifier Platinum
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 217
    • View Profile
    • Free Keene
Re: Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2012, 07:13:14 PM »

The fucked up thing is that even giving away beer to someone is a felony in NH.  At least that's what Brad Jardis told me.  So, therefore any giving away or accepting "donations" or selling a pencil and giving a free beer, or anything EXCEPT each individual buying beer from a licensed vendor is a felony. 

It's insane.

I apologize if I communicated incorrectly.  Giving away liquor is legal....  Direct and indirect sales are not.

Logged
-/-
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  General
| | |-+  Will Porcfest 2012 be the beginning of the end?

// ]]>

Page created in 0.024 seconds with 34 queries.