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Author Topic: The FSP is a religion  (Read 30032 times)

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Richard Garner

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #105 on: April 01, 2009, 04:07:24 PM »

Slightly freer New Hampshire where you get to hang out with other libertarians but not make that much of a difference just doesn't have the same ring.

Sounds better than living here in the UK at the moment!
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Jetfire

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #106 on: April 01, 2009, 04:08:50 PM »

I still wanna know whats up with the organizers of the FSP. Whats going on with that which apparently makes things so bad?
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anarchir

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #107 on: April 01, 2009, 04:22:21 PM »

I still wanna know whats up with the organizers of the FSP. Whats going on with that which apparently makes things so bad?

Besides the misquoting of numbers, I'm with you on this one: Lost.

I still think that even as a gathering social thing, hanging out with other activists not just as a club, but as a way of life seems pretty fun.
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NHArticleTen

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Re: The Free State Project is dead
« Reply #108 on: April 01, 2009, 04:22:58 PM »

I still wanna know whats up with the organizers of the FSP. Whats going on with that which apparently makes things so bad?

since a large portion of the original stated goal of the FSP was the goal/critical-mass membership number of 20K...by their own admissions and intentions the membership numbers are, in fact, critical and integral to the FSP itself...

and...since that's the case...that core key component should, at the very least, be minimally accurate...or are we missing something?

to wit...

THERE IS NO...I REPEAT NO...independent, third-party verification of the ACTUAL membership number...none...

and what's more, if you had a list of all the signers...I'd challenge you to be able to contact and receive a valid reply from even 5K...let alone the 9K+ number currently showing on the FSP website...

so...

aside from many other issues of noteworthiness...the numbers game is just smoke, mirrors, and an illusion until such time as it is independently verified...

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Dylboz

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #109 on: April 01, 2009, 04:24:45 PM »

This a definite case of hating the players, instead of the game. We all hate the game, but the FSP is trying to play it to win. They are not picking up their ball and going home (the Galt option), instead they are instead trying to use the rules of the game set by their opponents to win. The kind of democratic majoritarian rule we've become accustomed to in America has created a constant ratchet effect, and effectively oppressing the minority who yearn to breathe free. So, rather than give in, they've decided to band together and turn the tables by BEING the majority in NH, but I just don't think that 20,000 people is enough.

There is no game.


You're not good with metaphors, are you?

I'm operating within your metaphor.

There is no game.

O... K...    :?
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anarchir

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #110 on: April 01, 2009, 04:25:52 PM »

So just stupid numbers things. Meh. Thats still way more activists than here in WI. All we have is stupid Democrats radiating from Madison.
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Richard Garner

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #111 on: April 01, 2009, 04:33:04 PM »

So just stupid numbers things. Meh. Thats still way more activists than here in WI. All we have is stupid Democrats radiating from Madison.

Absolutely. Here, every october, every libertarian in the UK comes to conference in October. We get record size conferences when a couple of hundred show up. Having that many in a place as small as NH would be a great improvement!
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Jetfire

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #112 on: April 01, 2009, 04:37:01 PM »

I *like* NH. Well, parts of NH.

The FSP doesn't do anything for me, cus I'm not looking for a social club to hang out with and agree with me.

I might be interested in living in a "liberty compound", if it was set up right. But having a goal of taking over a state, or even town is pretty much out of the question for me. I just want them to "leave me alone".

its not just a social club either. They have activism and press growing there. I dont want to sit idly by while government strips freedoms away.
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BonerJoe

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Re: The FSP is a religion
« Reply #113 on: April 01, 2009, 04:37:40 PM »

Point proven.
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NHArticleTen

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #114 on: April 01, 2009, 04:50:49 PM »

So just stupid numbers things. Meh. Thats still way more activists than here in WI. All we have is stupid Democrats radiating from Madison.

Absolutely. Here, every october, every libertarian in the UK comes to conference in October. We get record size conferences when a couple of hundred show up. Having that many in a place as small as NH would be a great improvement!

no offense to any previous poster here but...and I'm gonna do the shouting caps thingy...

WTF...

THE MAJORITY OF THE FSP MEMBERS IN NH ARE MOST CERTAINLY NOT VOLUNTARYISTS...NOT BY A LONG SHOT...

ok, throttling back a little...whew...

first of all, NH won partially because of a core group of libertarian activists already in NH(Michelle Dumas and company)...

Michelle and company signed up hundreds of NHites to the FSP and gained an advantage over other states as a result...not that that is necessarily a bad thing...

anyways, so these hundreds of NHites might be democrats...or republicans...or libertarians...or voluntaryists...or whatever...

but I can tell you for sure that several hundred of them might be seen a few times a year...if that...and then who knows which philosophy they're in bed with today...

by my rough estimates there are perhaps a hundred serious FSP activists in NH...

out of those, half think they can vote themselves freedom and liberty...the other half understand that if voting mattered...it would be outlawed...

and out of the voluntaryists there are a substantial number who still cower and grovel to the clowns in costumes with shiny tin stars and plenty of lethal toys...

because we all already know that "voting" is useless...and as time goes on...the civdisers are all going to get dragged away to the gulags and death camps...

so...

The John Galt Solution is the only solution...

Atlas Shrugged, Owner's Manual For The Universe...

enjoy!

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blackie

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #115 on: April 01, 2009, 05:04:51 PM »


first of all, NH won partially because of a core group of libertarian activists already in NH(Michelle Dumas and company)...

Michelle and company signed up hundreds of NHites to the FSP and gained an advantage over other states as a result...not that that is necessarily a bad thing...
The NH Mafia.
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John Shaw

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Re: The FSP is a religion
« Reply #116 on: April 01, 2009, 05:09:45 PM »

If the FSP didn't reach it's projected goal of 20,000 members by 2006, it was supposed to be disbanded.

Not only did they not disband, (Fine, whatever, have a redo.) they never removed all of the people who agreed to their original date of project completion from the roster of participants.

The contract ended (Yes, it was a contract originally) and they kept the participant number and just kept chugging along. They also refuse to remove people from their membership, and hassle them if asked to.

I am one of these people.

Quote
FSP Registration
jason.sorens@yale.edu
8/1/2002 6:16 PM

Dear John,

Just a quick note to let you know that we received your registration for
the Free State Project.  Thanks, and welcome!  I'll add you to the
announcements list, and another email will follow with more information.

Best,
Jason Sorens, President
Free State Project

________________________________________________________________________

Jason P Sorens---jason.sorens@yale.edu---http://pantheon.yale.edu/~jps35

http://www.freestateproject.org - Do you want liberty in your lifetime?
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NHArticleTen

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Re: The FSP is a religion
« Reply #117 on: April 01, 2009, 05:11:39 PM »


yeah...that...

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Dave P. R. of S.

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Re: The FSP is dead
« Reply #118 on: April 01, 2009, 05:21:31 PM »

[
Michelle and company signed up hundreds of NHites to the FSP and gained an advantage over other states as a result...not that that is necessarily a bad thing...


The John Galt Solution is the only solution...

If you are going to give background, how about a date this all came into being?

That said, right now, with the low numbers of FSPers in NH, I'd think Michigan would be a better place to go.  It has water access and an international border.  And everyone is leaving.  :lol:

You could buy an entire town cheap there today.

How cheap you ask?  Dude picked up 17 acres bordering on the Nightmare golf course for a Krugerrand down.

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John Shaw

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Re: The FSP is a religion
« Reply #119 on: April 01, 2009, 05:28:40 PM »

I'd think Michigan would be a better place to go. 

Michigan (The state) is projecting a 7% increase in unemployment by the end of 2009.

The current rate is 12%.

That makes 19%, or one in five people.

Sure, come get some. :Rollseyes:
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