(11:36:03 PM) Lindsey`: You need to change your business model to develop yourself a personality, because a rapport with your "customers" is what's going to make them trust you, like you, and want to give you money.
(11:36:07 PM) MobileDigit: Paulish, go back and check what I said, you will see I didn't say I could never be wrong. If you aren't willing to go back and look to check my evidence, are you really arguing with me, or are you just believing government and god and the failure of my idea are necessarily true.
(11:36:16 PM) Lindsey`: If you're going to try this horse shit, at least try doing it well.
(11:36:17 PM) MobileDigit: I propose the latter.
(11:36:21 PM) Lindsey`: And not being a dick.
(11:37:15 PM) rabidfurby: Mobile, you might also want to not lump anyone who disagrees with you in with statists and theists.
(11:37:36 PM) Lindsey`: Yeah, that's also really good advice.
(11:37:45 PM) MobileDigit: You aren't centralizing it, you are decentralizing it! I am giving you the power to make money spreading liberty. If anyone wants to copy my idea and get people to give money to an org so that it can pay liberty activists, be my guest! My ultimate goal is complete liberty, the money I make, and fun You and I can have, is just a side benefit.
(11:37:50 PM) Lindsey`: If you want to trick people in to parting with their money, you can't be a goddamned asshole.
(11:38:02 PM) Lindsey`: I don't think I have ever experienced fun with you involved.
(11:38:09 PM) MobileDigit: What should I change my business model to, Lindsey?
(11:38:23 PM) Lindsey`: I just fucking TOLD you what you need to implement.
(11:38:27 PM) Lindsey`: Can you read?
(11:38:30 PM) Paulish: this is what I call slactavism
(11:38:30 PM) MobileDigit: I don't mean to be a dick, but if you were in my position would you really say anything different?
(11:38:30 PM) Lindsey`: Do you have any friends?
(11:38:34 PM) Lindsey`: Do you ever go outside?
(11:38:37 PM) Paulish: you dont have time to stand up for your principle
(11:38:40 PM) Paulish: so pay others to do it
(11:38:44 PM) Lindsey`: I wouldn't be in your position, because I think you're nuts.
(11:38:53 PM) MobileDigit: I don't mean to be a goddamned asshole. I only want you to want to help me spread liberty.
(11:39:00 PM) Paulish: we are
(11:39:06 PM) Paulish: we just dont think $$ needs to be involved
(11:39:11 PM) MobileDigit: Are you my friend Lindsey?
(11:39:20 PM) Lindsey`: I've never even met you.
(11:39:32 PM) Lindsey`: My friends don't usually make me want to punch babies, either.
(11:39:49 PM) Paulish: my friends do
(11:39:51 PM) Paulish: is that wierd?
(11:39:53 PM) Paulish: oh wait
(11:39:53 PM) MobileDigit: slactavism? Are you implying that I am not on the internet talking about liberty right now? I am not slacking, I am working. AND SPREADING LIBERTY.
(11:39:54 PM) Lindsey`: Yes.
(11:39:57 PM) Lindsey`: You need new friends.
(11:39:59 PM) Paulish: I always want to punch babies
(11:40:02 PM) Paulish: nvm its me
(11:40:09 PM) Paulish:
I jk
(11:40:10 PM) Lindsey`: You can't spread liberty to people that already believe in liberty
(11:40:23 PM) Paulish: i am not saying you are a slacker
(11:40:29 PM) Lindsey`: Especially in a room full of people who think you're batshit, and are laughing at you.
(11:40:35 PM) Lindsey`: Oh wait...
(11:40:38 PM) Lindsey`: We're laughing with you.
(11:40:39 PM) MobileDigit: Fuck that idea paulish, money is vital to humanity's successfull ability to have a division of labor, which is the reason having more minds makes us more prosperous.
(11:40:40 PM) Lindsey`: Yes, that's it.
(11:40:43 PM) Paulish: I am saying if people think giving you money every month will bring liberty, they are diluted
(11:40:57 PM) Lindsey`: Nah, they're just idiots.
(11:41:04 PM) Lindsey`: You think they're watered down?
(11:41:06 PM) MobileDigit: You don't believe in what I think is true liberty: Ultimate knowledge agnosticism.
(11:41:07 PM) Lindsey`: Wait. What?!
(11:41:27 PM) MobileDigit: And you don't want to pay me, so can you see how from my point of view you don't want liberty?
(11:41:38 PM) Paulish: no i cant
(11:41:42 PM) Paulish: free talk live asks for money
(11:41:48 PM) Paulish: but doesnt say your against them if you dont give
(11:42:26 PM) Lindsey`: This is completely beyond all reproach.
(11:42:35 PM) Lindsey`: I think I'm crying from laughing so hard.
(11:42:35 PM) rabidfurby:
http://static.mmoabc.com/my/M/i/c/hael/2008/2/3//1202097987293.jpg(11:42:36 PM) MobileDigit: I ultimately don't care if you think I am batshit if you ultimately end up agreeing with me, which I think you will unless you are intellectually dishonest. I honestly believe I can convince you, if you are just willing to be convinced. Open minds, open markets.
(11:42:39 PM) Lindsey`: Or because this is circular.
(11:42:51 PM) rabidfurby: This is epic.
(11:42:53 PM) Lindsey`: I think you're the one that needs to open your mind.
(11:42:57 PM) rabidfurby: Absolutely epic.
(11:43:05 PM) Lindsey`: To the possibility that there is a better way than paying you for something.
(11:43:28 PM) MobileDigit: FTL should say that if you don't give them money, you are not rational, because FTL does a huge amount of work, and it's worth way more than $3 a month.
(11:43:43 PM) Paulish: why do you insist that you are the authority on rational?
(11:43:51 PM) Lindsey`: Uhm, well, they don't. Because Ian is not crazy.
(11:44:05 PM) Lindsey`: I think it's irrational that you think you're presenting a rational plan.
(11:44:06 PM) Paulish: How do you know the people you "convince" dont just turn back to their way of thinking the second you leave
(11:44:09 PM) Paulish: and that would be waste
(11:44:10 PM) rabidfurby: FTL's strategy has them getting $2700+ a month. How's your strategy working out?
(11:44:11 PM) MobileDigit: rabid: funny pic
(11:44:35 PM) Lindsey`: I also think I have to be up in like four and a half hours, so I'm going go back to ignoring you and go to sleep.
(11:44:39 PM) Paulish: With my friends I can gradually watch them grow if you know what I mean
(11:44:50 PM) MobileDigit: It is not circular. Every time you agree with a point I make you advance toward my argument that little bit.
(11:44:51 PM) Paulish: and it spiderwebs out
(11:45:01 PM) Paulish: not true
(11:45:09 PM) Paulish: the destination could be different
(11:45:14 PM) Paulish: even with the same points
(11:45:24 PM) Lindsey`: No, trust me - I'm not advancing toward your side.
(11:45:33 PM) MobileDigit: I don't insist I am the authority on rational, I just want the best future possible and I really believe I can help humanity out one by one. Is that really such a crazy idea, Lindsey?
(11:45:39 PM) Paulish: omg Lindsey making advances on mibiledigit?
(11:45:41 PM) Lindsey`: You're only convincing me that you're crazier than I thought in the first place.
(11:46:01 PM) Paulish: why do you do this for money
(11:46:10 PM) Paulish: why dont you do it because you are passionate for liberty?
(11:46:15 PM) Paulish: is that not enough?
(11:46:17 PM) MobileDigit: rabid: I have earned $0 so far, but yall are the first people I've shared this idea with.
(11:46:22 PM) Lindsey`: You want to help humanity? Give some of your money to poor people so they can buy an outfit to wear to a job interview, so they can get back on their feet and work. Go work in a soup kitchen to feed the homeless.
(11:46:26 PM) Lindsey`: Do something for someone else.
(11:46:28 PM) MobileDigit: It does spiderweb out, exactly.
(11:46:42 PM) Paulish: I am saying with friends
(11:46:46 PM) Paulish: not so much with strangers
(11:46:59 PM) MobileDigit: The destination could be different, but I think I can bring you to my point of view if you are willing to advance the argument and ask me questions when you disagree.
(11:47:13 PM) Lindsey`: WE HAVE BEEN
(11:47:14 PM) Paulish: I realized
(11:47:21 PM) Paulish: I have no fucking clue what your "position" is
(11:47:24 PM) Paulish: just that you want money
(11:47:30 PM) Lindsey`: YOU KEEP TELLING US THAT YOU'RE THE MOST RATIONAL PERSON HERE, THAT YOU'RE NEVER WRONG, AND THAT WE SHOULD COME TO THE DARK SIDE.
(11:47:32 PM) MobileDigit: I hope you will Lindsey, because I really think You can help make liberty happen. Why is that crazy?
(11:47:46 PM) Lindsey`: DRINK THE GODDAMNED FUCKING KOOL-AID YOU FUCKING ASSHOLE MORONS.
(11:47:47 PM) MobileDigit: How are you defining crazy?
(11:47:49 PM) ***Lindsey` dies
(11:47:57 PM) Paulish: "I find your lack of faith disturbing..."
(11:48:03 PM) Lindsey`: You're not making any sense, dude.
(11:48:05 PM) Lindsey`: Seriously.
(11:48:22 PM) Lindsey`: I've argued with you. You ignore it and move back to saying the same thing over and over again.
(11:48:31 PM) Lindsey`: You think you're right, I think I'm right.
(11:48:33 PM) Lindsey`: it ends there.
(11:48:38 PM) Paulish: All hail the great leader MobileDigit!
(11:48:40 PM) rabidfurby: Mobile, you are really some AI that some crazy geek has been working on in secret for like 20 years, right?
(11:48:51 PM) MobileDigit: My main purpose is not the money, it is the liberty. I came out to my dad with about my agnosticism on 2008-02-12, and this idea crystallized in my head.
(11:48:52 PM) Lindsey`: Maybe he's one of Brede's experiments.
(11:49:08 PM) Lindsey`: I would like to see Brede presented with this idea.
(11:49:19 PM) Paulish: hrm
(11:49:21 PM) MobileDigit: I am passionate for liberty, and it is enough. But money greases social interaction. There is no reason to fear money.
(11:49:21 PM) Lindsey`: THAT would be more fun than a barrel full of drunk monkeys.
(11:49:34 PM) Paulish: there is no reason to fear money is right
(11:49:35 PM) Lindsey`: Uhh, trust me - I don't think any of us fear money.
(11:49:38 PM) Paulish: in fact i want it
(11:49:42 PM) Paulish: in my bank
(11:49:44 PM) Paulish: where it belongs
(11:50:11 PM) Lindsey`: Sometimes I keep it in my bra. If I were afraid of it, I wouldn't keep it next to the one thing that sets me apart from the rest of the women around me.
(11:50:20 PM) rabidfurby: Bullshit. If you were rational, you would know that money clearly belongs in my bank.
(11:50:25 PM) MobileDigit: If you just give money to poor people they will not improve their lives as much as if you give them my message of the future of humanity, where all information is available simply by googling.
(11:50:36 PM) Lindsey`: I'm rational enough to know that your penis belongs in my vagina!
(11:50:40 PM) Paulish: knowledge is free right?
(11:50:49 PM) Lindsey`: Right. Your message is much better than food.
(11:50:51 PM) Lindsey`: FUCK FOOD.
(11:50:53 PM) Lindsey`: Who eats?
(11:50:54 PM) Paulish: so why do we need to pay you
(11:51:04 PM) Lindsey`: He won't answer it, Paul.
(11:51:06 PM) Lindsey`: Don't bother.
(11:51:16 PM) Paulish: dont bother?
(11:51:18 PM) Lindsey`: I already pointed out to him that we can just as easily spread the message of liberty ourselves.
(11:51:19 PM) Paulish: hey guys
(11:51:27 PM) Paulish: give me money and I will pay this guy a personal visit
(11:51:42 PM) Lindsey`: He completely circumvents it with a pile of nothing.
(11:52:09 PM) MobileDigit: I really don't understand you're problem with what I am doing. Did you not see this picture of Bubba?
http://whirlwindmissions.smugmug.com/gallery/4339160_4SdaS#254555719_a2k2W-A-LB See that thing I gave him? That used to be mine. I am going to help him learn about liberty and teach him how to program. Fuck you for thinking I am not helping homeless people. Bubba IS homeless!
(11:52:42 PM) Lindsey`: I think someone should give me money so I can start a Chinese restaurant where we put only liberty-themed fortunes in the fortune cookies.
(11:52:42 PM) MobileDigit: Everyone is ultimately rational, and thus I think everyone will eventually come to my conclusion.
(11:52:47 PM) Lindsey`: See, there you go off the deep end again.
(11:53:01 PM) Lindsey`: With the fuck yous if you don't agree with MobileDigit thing.
(11:53:09 PM) Lindsey`: Fuck you for not agreeing with me.
(11:53:13 PM) Lindsey`:
(11:53:14 PM) ***Lindsey` snickers
(11:53:34 PM) Paulish: that sounds like what Christians are doing in africa
(11:53:47 PM) MobileDigit: I met Bubba as a person for the first time on 2008-02-16. I helped his life by giving him that cool thinkgeek gadget.
(11:53:48 PM) Paulish: "We will feed you, but first you have to convert and read the bible"
(11:54:01 PM) Lindsey`: Oh, you mean that thing that the rest of the world has hated us for for thousands of years?
(11:54:14 PM) Paulish: but instead "I will give you gadgets, but only if you let me brainwash you"
(11:54:19 PM) Lindsey`: Uhm, MD...TODAY is the 16th of February, and it only has been for three hours.
(11:54:39 PM) MobileDigit: Listen Lindsey, I am going to put everything I think on my website, AdvanceTheArgument.com. If you are interested in making money to spread liberty, you need to go there.
(11:55:08 PM) Lindsey`: Should I drink the Kool-Aid, sire?
(11:55:18 PM) Lindsey`: HOW ABOUT YOU JUST BEND ME OVER AND FUCK ME WHILE YOU'RE AT IT
(11:55:21 PM) ***Lindsey` dies
(11:55:32 PM) rabidfurby: Hey, that's my job.
(11:55:35 PM) MobileDigit: At the very bottom is a link to send me a few cents (10 or so), if you think I might be on to something here, just like Einstein was onto the theory of relativity and the idea the light is the fastest speed possible.
(11:55:38 PM) Lindsey`: Oh yes, well.
(11:56:05 PM) rabidfurby: Are you actually comparing yourself to Einstein?
(11:56:10 PM) Paulish: i think he did
(11:56:18 PM) Paulish: you know
(11:56:27 PM) Paulish: its the crazy libertarians that make our job hard
(11:56:32 PM) Lindsey`: I think I just died a little on the inside.
(11:56:43 PM) Lindsey`: Someone hand me my tinfoil hat, and let me rest in peace.
(11:56:55 PM) MobileDigit: #1 - I don't think I ever said I was the most rational person (and I hope you will email me the chat history so I don't loose it, my sister's boyfriend Miles wanted to read it), because I believe everyone is ultimately always rational.
(11:57:10 PM) Lindsey`: YOU DID TOO SAY YOU WERE THE MOST RATIONAL PERSON HERE.
(11:57:34 PM) Paulish: one sec
(11:57:36 PM) Lindsey`: Oh fuck me in the Ozarks.
(11:57:38 PM) Paulish: leme check google desktop
(11:57:38 PM) Lindsey`: I give up.
(11:57:39 PM) Lindsey`: I'm going sleepy.
(11:57:45 PM) MobileDigit: I never said I am never wrong, just that I _believe_ I am never wrong, and if I am, then I want to change my mind to a better idea. Why don't you try to convince me of your idea?
(11:58:03 PM) Lindsey`: Because I'm going to bed, instead.
(11:58:04 PM) MobileDigit: I do want to your come to a side, but it is the side of liberty.
(11:58:26 PM) Paulish: cha ching
(11:58:27 PM) Paulish: found it
(11:58:28 PM) Paulish: (11:21:12 PM) MobileDigit: The difference is no one has successfully argued against my ideas. Just read over this chat log and you will see I am ultimately the most rational one here.
(11:58:30 PM) Lindsey`: You know why I'm going to bed? Because I'm very tired, and I work very hard at my job, and I must go there in a few hours and bust my ass.
(11:59:13 PM) Paulish: I think you owe ME ten cents
(11:59:16 PM) Paulish:
(11:59:35 PM) Lindsey`: I think you owe me a few thousand dollars for the past few hours of my life that I will never get back.
(11:59:41 PM) Paulish: I think a better way to fun yourself is with google adwords
(11:59:44 PM) Paulish: fund
(11:59:47 PM) Paulish: and with people
(11:59:48 PM) Paulish: doing stuff
(11:59:51 PM) Paulish: not paying you to do it
(11:59:54 PM) Paulish: end
(11:59:55 PM) Paulish: no more
(11:59:59 PM) MobileDigit: Paulish, I do find your lack of trust in me as a superhuman (that's the term I am using now, and I think you can be superhuman too if you are willing to always advance the argument, at advancetheargument.com, or by sending me an email.) disturbing, but I understand it. I hope You will come to the position I have, sooner rather than later, so we can have liberty now instead of later.
(2/16/2008 12:00:16 AM) shinyvandal left the room (quit: "ASCII a stupid question, get a stupid ANSI!").
(12:00:16 AM) Paulish: am i an operating thetan too!
(12:01:01 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money
(12:01:12 AM) Paulish: ?*
(12:01:52 AM) rabidfurby: superhuman? are you fucking serious?
(12:02:06 AM) Paulish: I think he is the next L Ron Hubbard
(12:02:37 AM) Paulish: I will be 60 and it will by "Unkown vs Superhuman Digits on the internetv4.0
(12:02:40 AM) Paulish: "
(12:02:52 AM) MobileDigit: Lindsey, I don't mean to ignore anything you say. I think everything you say helps me, which is why I want to know what you think. What exactly did I ignorre, and how did I exacty move back to saying the same thing? All I want to do is understand your point of view. "There is no reason to be hostile." - This is the idea superhumans reach. When we work in accordance with ourselves, our family, our superfamily (humanity itself
(12:03:01 AM) Paulish: kinda like "$ientology vs anon"
(12:03:10 AM) MobileDigit: Paulish, Do You think I am a good leader?
(12:03:23 AM) Paulish: from what I have heard
(12:03:35 AM) Paulish: you are not quite the charismatic guy people want in leaders
(12:03:45 AM) Paulish: but answer my question
(12:03:48 AM) Paulish: or this goes no further
(12:03:52 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money?
(12:04:19 AM) MobileDigit: Yes rabid, to tell you the truth, I just may be. I have an idea of how to implement AI using Paul Graham's infinity language, Arc. You can help me make this a reality, if that is something you want. Is it?
(12:05:45 AM) Paulish: you avoid the question
(12:05:49 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money?
(12:05:50 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money?
(12:05:50 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money?
(12:05:51 AM) Paulish: do you take issue with me spreading liberty without giving you money?
(12:06:34 AM) rabidfurby: you do knoe that Arc is just a thin wrapper around Scheme, and has no more computational power than any other Turing-equivalent language, right?
(12:07:19 AM) Paulish: pwnt
(12:07:26 AM) MobileDigit: Lindsey, I don't think you are right. You (and I mean that mind inside that brain of yours Lindsey, needs to advance beyond your incorrect assumptions like that you are definitely right, and accept my position of Ultimate knowledge agnosticism. My only claim is in the form of a question: There is possibility? I smoke cannabis, think, and then respond with: There is possibility!
(12:07:56 AM) MobileDigit: Brede, yes. That's who I need to get into touch with on my idea about AI!
(12:08:28 AM) Paulish: oh my jesus
(12:08:34 AM) Paulish: he is talking to people who arn't here
(12:09:23 AM) Paulish: "accept my position of Ultimate knowledge agnosticism."
(12:09:27 AM) Paulish: that sounds so cultlike
and its done... I think