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Author Topic: Jews and Communism  (Read 7822 times)

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Ghost of Alex Libman

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Jews and Communism
« on: May 05, 2009, 05:00:08 PM »

(Forked from a "Fear of Death in Different Cultures" thread, where conversation has touched upon the Jewish culture and its role in the Soviet revolution.)


A quote from an "anti-semitic" Web-site:

Quote
In pre-WW1 Germany the Socialist Party, the SPD, was founded by the Jew Ferdinand Lasalle.  The Jews Eduard Bernstein and Otto Landsberg were prominent leaders, its leading journalists were Jews as were its Socialist theorists Adolf Braun and Simon Katzenstein.

In the first government of Communist Russia there were only 13 ethnic Russian Commissars and more than 300 Jewish Commissars out of a total of 384 Commissars.  The billionaire New York Jew Jacob Schiff was the revolution's chief financier.  Jews were 1.7% of the population of Russia.

Of the 6 members of Lenin's first Politburo, three were Jews, Trotsky, Kamenev, and Zinoviev.

The Jews had their own Jewish section of the Communist Party, the Evsektsiya.

In 1919 when a Communist government was established in Hungary four of the five members of the directorate were Jews.

In Eastern Europe Jewish Communists provided the Soviet Union with leadership in East Germany, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Romania and Hungary.  The Jew Bela Kun established the Hungarian Communist Party in 1919 and Jews predominated in the leadership.  Out of 26 ministers and vice-ministers 20 were Jews.  Kun was overthrown by French backed Rumanian forces after 100 days.  Kun's sucessor, the Jew Matyas Rakosi was a mass murderer [...].   The Jewish Telegraph Agency of May 14, 1997, said the Jews "...played key roles in ushering Communist rule into Hungary. In fact, during the brutal oppression of the early 1950s, the regime's top five leaders were Jews."

In Czechoslovakia an estimated 20,000 Jews out of an original several hundred thousand survived the Nazi occupation and death camps.  Yet Jews were the major force in the Communist Party rule.  The Jew Rudolph Slansky was secretary general of the party and Jews ran the ministries of foreign affairs, foreign trade, state planning and propaganda.   

In Hungary Jews headed the ministries of state planning, industry and commerce and Radio Hungary.  The Jew Mathias Rakosi was the head of the Communist Party, General Peter Gabor commanded the secret police, Joseph Reval was minister of culture and the regimes chief propagandist.  

Between 7,000 to 10,000 Jews served in Joseph Stalin's "International Brigade" of 40,000 volunteers which fought against Franco's forces in Spain.  A third of them were American Jews.

Jewish control of Communism was lessened in The Great Terror, Stalin's 1930's purges.  Of the 10 million killed in the purges approximately 500,000 were Jews and made up a majority of the politically prominent of those who were executed.  Stalin was planning another purge of Jews with plans for sending a considerable number to Siberia but he died before the plan was put into action.

At least eighteen generals in the Yugoslav Communist People's Army were Jewish.  Approximately 75% of the officers of the Communist Secret Police in Polish Silesia were Jews.

The three communist leaders who dominated Poland between 1948 and 1956, Jacob Berman, Boleslaw Bierut, Hilary Minc, were Jews.  Boleslaw Bierut had four villas and the use of five more.

Please debunk one by one.  No ad hominem attacks allowed.  Also, this thread isn't for discussing the relevance of the Jews' involvement in communism, just the facts.

This ought to keep Demosthenes & Co busy for the next couple of years, eh?  :lol:

« Last Edit: May 05, 2009, 06:17:55 PM by the ghost of Alex Libman »
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Sam Gunn (since nobody got Admiral Naismith)

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2009, 06:06:47 PM »

Yeah take a look at that website.  Serious stuff huh.
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Ghost of Alex Libman

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2009, 06:08:55 PM »

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davann

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2009, 06:43:51 PM »

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Ghost of Alex Libman

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2009, 07:05:39 PM »

Jews and communists and pricks, oh my...

This thread can only handle two of those.
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Sam Gunn (since nobody got Admiral Naismith)

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2009, 07:51:26 PM »

All of them were white too.  Guess all white people are Communists.
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"Do not throw rocks at people with guns." —Hastings' Third Law
"Income tax returns are the most imaginative fiction being written today." —Herman Wouk 

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom." - Dwight D. Eisenhower

Ghost of Alex Libman

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2009, 08:28:47 PM »

Predictable Zionist is predictable.  :roll:

Also, this thread isn't for discussing the relevance of the Jews' involvement in communism, just the facts.

This thread is about addressing those specific claims regarding the disproportionate involvement of individuals of Jewish cultural heritage / ethnicity in Communism.  Rough approximations of their skin color are irrelevant.


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Sam Gunn (since nobody got Admiral Naismith)

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2009, 08:42:01 PM »

You're an idiot Alex.
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"Do not throw rocks at people with guns." —Hastings' Third Law
"Income tax returns are the most imaginative fiction being written today." —Herman Wouk 

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom." - Dwight D. Eisenhower

Ghost of Alex Libman

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2009, 08:48:46 PM »

I take it you're not going to attempt to challenge the facts that I've quoted from that "Anti-Semitic" Web-site?

If that's the case, OK, my point in challenging your original assertion about the value of life in Jewish culture has been successful.

If not, please use this thread to make your points.
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Diogenes The Cynic

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2009, 10:24:21 PM »

Predictable Zionist is predictable.  :roll:

Also, this thread isn't for discussing the relevance of the Jews' involvement in communism, just the facts.



Redundant joke is redundant.


Redundant joke is redundant.
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Dude, I thought you were a spambot for like a week. You posted like a spambot. You failed the Turing test.

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TimeLady Victorious

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2009, 08:08:33 AM »

so alex, does that mean you're a dirty Commie?
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Ghost of Alex Libman

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2009, 09:02:07 AM »

Oh, why do I even bother... 

This thread, and the one it's forked from, generalize about typical cultural attributes.

Correlation does not imply causation.
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mrbone

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2009, 10:40:18 PM »

The anti-semites like to go overboard with "finding the Jew", sort of like Alex Jones seeing NWO agents under every rock. But there is a kernel of truth to the Communism arguments.

The Reform Judaism movement had as its goal assimilation with the local culture while retaining the important parts of Jewish religion, whereas before then Jews largely lived very seperate from society. Their pre-19th century lifestyle reminds me of the Amish in many ways, though not as extreme. This assimiliation aproach of the Reform movement was successful in Lithuania(?) until Czarist Russia conquered the territory. The Czar was extremely cruel to the Jews, as bad or worse than any other dictator who attacked Jews in prior history. This disillussioned many Reform Jews. Part of the reason for the assimilation was to become more welcomed by host populations, and instead they got worse cruelty than before. This gave Reform Jews in Russia an incentive to rebel against not only the government but also the local culture. And replace it with what? The experience also had a second affect: dissillusionment with traditional Jewish thought in general, leaving an intellectual vacuum that was ripe to be filled with all kinds of crazy ideologies, including Communism. These two factors coming together led to Jews having a disproportionate impact on waging revolution against the Czar and pushing communism as its replacement. This is basic non-controversial history. You can hear similar sentiments from Jewish talkshow host Michael Medved or from rabbi lectures on history/ (I recommend the Rabbi Ken Spiro series on Jewish history from an Orthodox perspective. He covers the things i describe above very well.)

Like most revolutions, there were a variety of factors in play with each faction having its own motivation for their own self interest. Russia had the largest Jewish population in the world. They went from being prosperous, upstanding members of society to destitute slaves under the Czar. Go read up on how the Czar treated them. Then is it any surprise that they would work to overthrow the Czar? And is it any surprise that the Jews that did get into post-Czar seats of power in Russia abused the power? The point lost on many anti-semites (especially the socialist varieties that praise big government): those Jews who did gain political power wielded it pretty much the way everyone wields political power: evilly. Power corrupts everyone.
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Diogenes The Cynic

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2009, 11:11:47 PM »

We just had an argument at my Yeshiva yesterday as to what type of economy the Torah espouses, and what type of politics. Its clear after I argued with my Rabbi that the Torah cannot be pro socialist, libertarian, conservative, or liberal. Whats more, of the guys in my yeshiva, the libertarians outnumber the liberals by a margin of 4:1. Its all personal choice really.
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Dude, I thought you were a spambot for like a week. You posted like a spambot. You failed the Turing test.

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Alex Libman 14

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Re: Jews and Communism
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2009, 01:33:59 AM »

[...]  Whats more, of the guys in my yeshiva, the libertarians outnumber the liberals by a margin of 4:1.

Wow...  Given the typical Jewish voting trends, there has so be selection bias of some sort... 

Is your yeshiva special in some way?  :?
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