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Author Topic: If borders don't exist...  (Read 10915 times)

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Turd Ferguson

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2010, 08:31:00 AM »

If we're in a world where there is no government to stop me from shooting people I don't want on my property, why shouldn't I, if I have signs placed very prominently TRESPASSERS WILL BE SHOT.

Okay, but you have to post one in Mexican as well.

Can the spanish one just say "WARNING: Inability to read the other sign may be hazardous to your health"?  :P
« Last Edit: September 17, 2010, 08:36:52 AM by quickmike »
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Richard Garner

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #31 on: September 17, 2010, 10:12:38 AM »

So, border enforcement is OK as long as it's private property. I think the majority of the land across the border is privately owned,

Which makes building a big wall across the border a violation of the owners' property rights, of course.

And also mean that if the owner wants Mexicans to come onto or across his land, then he should be allowed to let them, regardless of what the INS think.

Quote
or would become such in a free society. It's OK to shoot he Mexicans then, right?

Nope, firstly because trespass doesn't work like that. First you have to tell them they are not welcome on your land. Then you have to have evidence that they don't intend to leave.
Beyond that, we can ask whether shooting them is proportionate to the offense.
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AntonLee

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #32 on: September 17, 2010, 10:49:27 AM »

what Richard said.
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TimeLady Victorious

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #33 on: September 17, 2010, 12:40:55 PM »

Quote
Nope, firstly because trespass doesn't work like that. First you have to tell them they are not welcome on your land. Then you have to have evidence that they don't intend to leave.

If we lived in a truly "free" society . . . what would stop me from shooting anyone who came on my land if I so wished, warning or no warning?
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ENGAGE RIDLEY MOTHER FUCKER

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #34 on: September 17, 2010, 01:16:52 PM »

You can make whatever rules you want, you just can't arbitrarily enforce them to the extent that they deny the rights (to life) of others.  Now, if it's self-defense, in the act of forcing him off your property, that's different.

If we're in a world where there is no government to stop me from shooting people I don't want on my property, why shouldn't I, if I have signs placed very prominently TRESPASSERS WILL BE SHOT.

You will be punished by the market for your abuse of force, if it becomes known.
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TimeLady Victorious

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #35 on: September 17, 2010, 01:40:12 PM »

You can make whatever rules you want, you just can't arbitrarily enforce them to the extent that they deny the rights (to life) of others.  Now, if it's self-defense, in the act of forcing him off your property, that's different.

If we're in a world where there is no government to stop me from shooting people I don't want on my property, why shouldn't I, if I have signs placed very prominently TRESPASSERS WILL BE SHOT.

You will be punished by the market for your abuse of force, if it becomes known.

Yeah you see I have no problem at all with that.

Also, what's to stop a giant gang of people from saying, "fuck your property rights" and coming to my property and stringing me up on a tree for defending my property?
« Last Edit: September 17, 2010, 01:42:59 PM by TimeLady Victorious »
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davann

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #36 on: September 17, 2010, 01:58:38 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #37 on: September 17, 2010, 02:41:27 PM »

You can make whatever rules you want, you just can't arbitrarily enforce them to the extent that they deny the rights (to life) of others.  Now, if it's self-defense, in the act of forcing him off your property, that's different.

If we're in a world where there is no government to stop me from shooting people I don't want on my property, why shouldn't I, if I have signs placed very prominently TRESPASSERS WILL BE SHOT.

You will be punished by the market for your abuse of force, if it becomes known.

Yeah you see I have no problem at all with that.

Also, what's to stop a giant gang of people from saying, "fuck your property rights" and coming to my property and stringing me up on a tree for defending my property?

The market's response.  You seem to underestimate it.
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #38 on: September 17, 2010, 02:44:32 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)
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Diogenes The Cynic

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #39 on: September 17, 2010, 02:46:08 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)

If the free market market becomes this powerful, what distinguishes it from a government?
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Dude, I thought you were a spambot for like a week. You posted like a spambot. You failed the Turing test.

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #40 on: September 17, 2010, 02:49:09 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)

If the free market market becomes this powerful, what distinguishes it from a government?

It will not have monopoly power.  Even the sickest slime will find other slime to do business with (as in the black market today) but it won't be civilized.
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BonerJoe

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2010, 02:53:03 PM »

I would just like to state that this thread resulted from some deep thinking in the shower. This is not actually what BonerJoe really believes.
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TimeLady Victorious

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2010, 03:33:56 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)

If the free market market becomes this powerful, what distinguishes it from a government?

It will not have monopoly power.  Even the sickest slime will find other slime to do business with (as in the black market today) but it won't be civilized.

OK.

What stops it from having monopoly power?
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ENGAGE RIDLEY MOTHER FUCKER

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2010, 04:03:32 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)

If the free market market becomes this powerful, what distinguishes it from a government?

It will not have monopoly power.  Even the sickest slime will find other slime to do business with (as in the black market today) but it won't be civilized.

OK.

What stops it from having monopoly power?

The free market?  Nature.  It's not a state.  There's no such thing as a monopoly except the state, and state-created monopolies.  You're basically rephrasing the "evil Bill Gates" question.  The nature of commerce in liberty doesn't allow a true monopoly--especially of power.
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TimeLady Victorious

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Re: If borders don't exist...
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2010, 04:13:42 PM »

If you don't have the freedom to make your own clearly displayed rules, then you're not free.

I wouldn't hold it against you if you felt you had a valid reason and a stated rule in place. People should respect your property and if they don't you are within your rights to do as you wish.

That is all.

I think you'd find quickly, if you killed for mere trespassing, that it's not a right you're entitled to enjoy for long (the reason the market will come up with a solution, such as organized sanction, is that otherwise, the mob will simply string you up.)

If the free market market becomes this powerful, what distinguishes it from a government?

It will not have monopoly power.  Even the sickest slime will find other slime to do business with (as in the black market today) but it won't be civilized.

OK.

What stops it from having monopoly power?

The free market?  Nature.  It's not a state.  There's no such thing as a monopoly except the state, and state-created monopolies.  You're basically rephrasing the "evil Bill Gates" question.  The nature of commerce in liberty doesn't allow a true monopoly--especially of power.

If a group believes themselves to have a monopoly on the use of force, and they enforce it, that makes them a government.
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