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Author Topic: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009  (Read 81250 times)

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blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #345 on: May 03, 2009, 09:09:30 AM »

http://freekeene.com/2009/05/02/sam%E2%80%99s-jail-blog-tuesday-april-28/

Quote
Tuesday, April 28:

Today at breakfast we were only given one half cup of milk today instead of the usual two. Given that milk is all I’m drinking, and I did my full set of stretches along with 2/3 of a yoga workout, my body needed it.

So John Sam Doe isn't drinking water? Or does he mean that milk is the only food he is ingesting?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eating
Quote
In general terms, eating (formally, ingestion) is the process of consuming food to provide for the nutritional needs of an animal, particularly their energy requirements and to grow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food
Quote
Food is any substance, usually composed of carbohydrates, fats, proteins and water, that can be eaten or drunk by an animal or human for nutrition or pleasure.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2009, 09:19:13 AM by blackie »
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NHArticleTen

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blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #347 on: May 04, 2009, 10:23:02 AM »


Kudos to Strike-The-Root Guest Editor Mike Powers for including a good story on Sam!

http://www.strike-the-root.com/

http://www.examiner.com/x-1449-Dallas-Libertarian-Examiner~y2009m5d3-Jailed-for-the-right-to-remain-silent


It's kinda weird to claim to be a reporter, and also refuse to identify yourself.
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NHArticleTen

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #348 on: May 04, 2009, 12:00:12 PM »


Kudos to Strike-The-Root Guest Editor Mike Powers for including a good story on Sam!

http://www.strike-the-root.com/

http://www.examiner.com/x-1449-Dallas-Libertarian-Examiner~y2009m5d3-Jailed-for-the-right-to-remain-silent


It's kinda weird to claim to be a reporter, and also refuse to identify yourself.

cause you MUST tell us WHO you are...before you report to us that the bridge we're on is collapsing...amiright?

or that the curtains behind Great White have been set on fire by the band's pyrotechnics...

and...after watching the video evidence of that particular night club fire...

one wonders why nobody put the fire out BEFORE it spread...

maybe they couldn't find anyone to report their name to...

to get approval and permission to stop the fire...

before it became a deadly disaster...

and killed all those people...

bodies piled up...

doorway...

blocked...

smoke...

death...

hmm...

meh...

...

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Rillion

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #349 on: May 04, 2009, 12:35:10 PM »

"Any lawyer worth his salt will tell the suspect in no uncertain terms to make no  statement to the police under any  circumstances."  -- Supreme Court Justice Robert Jackson, Watts v. Indiana, 1949

Quoted in "Don't talk to the police" by Professor James Duane, the very fast-speaking and somewhat annoying law professor in this video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4097602514885833865

I'm only 1/4 of the way through, not sure what I think yet.
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NHArticleTen

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #350 on: May 04, 2009, 01:50:16 PM »

"Any lawyer worth his salt will tell the suspect in no uncertain terms to make no  statement to the police under any  circumstances."  -- Supreme Court Justice Robert Jackson, Watts v. Indiana, 1949

Quoted in "Don't talk to the police" by Professor James Duane, the very fast-speaking and somewhat annoying law professor in this video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4097602514885833865

I'm only 1/4 of the way through, not sure what I think yet.


TRUER WORDS HAVE NEVER BEEN SPOKEN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik

[youtube=425,350]v/i8z7NC5sgik[/youtube]


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08fZQWjDVKE

[youtube=425,350]v/08fZQWjDVKE[/youtube]


ENJOY
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blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #351 on: May 04, 2009, 10:56:52 PM »

http://freekeene.com/2009/05/04/sams-jail-blog-thursday-april-30/

Quote
Sam’s Jail Blog: Thursday, April 30

....

Burke’s order continues:

“Should the defendant decide he is willing to provide true and accurate identifying information about himself — the kind of information any other defendant is expected to provide — and is willing to accept the conditions of bail, the court will schedule a video arraignment as soon as possible thereafter.”

“Until then the court is unwilling to schedule a trial date. While the prospect of the defendant’s indefinite confinement is distasteful, the court reiterates, however, that the defendant holds the key to his release.”


Sam is holding the keys to the jail in his own pocket. Identifying himself and agreeing to return for the trial are the keys.
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voodoo

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #352 on: May 05, 2009, 03:16:24 AM »

http://freekeene.com/2009/05/04/sams-jail-blog-thursday-april-30/

Quote
Sam’s Jail Blog: Thursday, April 30

....

Burke’s order continues:

“Should the defendant decide he is willing to provide true and accurate identifying information about himself — the kind of information any other defendant is expected to provide — and is willing to accept the conditions of bail, the court will schedule a video arraignment as soon as possible thereafter.”

“Until then the court is unwilling to schedule a trial date. While the prospect of the defendant’s indefinite confinement is distasteful, the court reiterates, however, that the defendant holds the key to his release.”


Sam is holding the keys to the jail in his own pocket. Identifying himself and agreeing to return for the trial are the keys.


Cool.  So fingerprints, mugshot, and DNA aren't enough.  It's not even enough to know the AKA, he has to vocalize it.

Which AKA?  SamIAm?  Sam Dodson?  What if grandma called him "pooky" once and he doesn't disclose that?  He might have a 24" penis and be known among the female population of Austin as Sam John Holmes.

Burke wants "true and accurate identifying information".  What proof can he offer?  I've thought about it a little and figured out that I can't produce any "true and accurate identifying information" other than fingerprints, mugshot, and DNA.  They aren't going to match anything, though, so even that is only proof that I'm a human being.

But, humans have rights in our system, right?  I mean, without that, humans are no different than any other animals.  So, we must afford each other rights or expose our base, animalistic sides.
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"It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself."  ~ Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XVII, 1782. ME 2:222

blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #353 on: May 05, 2009, 10:23:36 AM »

But, humans have rights in our system, right?  I mean, without that, humans are no different than any other animals.  So, we must afford each other rights or expose our base, animalistic sides.
You know what else humans have in "our" system?

A legal name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_name
Quote
Legal name is often the name which an individual is called at birth or which appears on their birth certificate (see birth name) or marriage certificate (in places that have a statute allowing a name change to be recorded at marriage).

A person's legal name typically comprises their given name and a family name. The order varies according to culture and country. There are also country-by-country differences on changes of legal names by marriage, see married name.

...

United States
Most states still allow the common law of changing one's name through non-fraudulent use and this is actually the most common method since most women who marry do not petition a court under the statutorily prescribed method, but simply use a new name (typically the husband's, a custom which started under the theory of coverture where a woman lost her identity and most rights when she married).[1] Most state courts have held that a legally assumed name (i.e., for a non-fraudulent purpose) is a legal name and usable as their true name, though assumed names are often not considered the person's technically true name.[2]

References
1  In re Natale, 527 S.W.2d 402 (Mo. App. 1975); In re Kruzel, 226 N.W.2d 458 (Wis. 1975).
2  Stuart v. Board of Supervisors, 295 A.2d 223 (Md. Ct. App. 1972); In re Hauptly, 312 N.E.2d 857 (Ind. 1974); United States v. Cox, 593 F.2d 46 (6th Cir. 1979). See also 10 U.S.C. § 1551 (2006).
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voodoo

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #354 on: May 05, 2009, 11:12:10 AM »

But, humans have rights in our system, right?  I mean, without that, humans are no different than any other animals.  So, we must afford each other rights or expose our base, animalistic sides.
You know what else humans have in "our" system?

A legal name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_name
Quote
Legal name is often the name which an individual is called at birth or which appears on their birth certificate (see birth name) or marriage certificate (in places that have a statute allowing a name change to be recorded at marriage).

A person's legal name typically comprises their given name and a family name. The order varies according to culture and country. There are also country-by-country differences on changes of legal names by marriage, see married name.

...

United States
Most states still allow the common law of changing one's name through non-fraudulent use and this is actually the most common method since most women who marry do not petition a court under the statutorily prescribed method, but simply use a new name (typically the husband's, a custom which started under the theory of coverture where a woman lost her identity and most rights when she married).[1] Most state courts have held that a legally assumed name (i.e., for a non-fraudulent purpose) is a legal name and usable as their true name, though assumed names are often not considered the person's technically true name.[2]

References
1  In re Natale, 527 S.W.2d 402 (Mo. App. 1975); In re Kruzel, 226 N.W.2d 458 (Wis. 1975).
2  Stuart v. Board of Supervisors, 295 A.2d 223 (Md. Ct. App. 1972); In re Hauptly, 312 N.E.2d 857 (Ind. 1974); United States v. Cox, 593 F.2d 46 (6th Cir. 1979). See also 10 U.S.C. § 1551 (2006).

I wasn't chipped at birth.  They didn't take fingerprints or DNA and the government didn't issue me a name.  I'm assuming it's the same with Sam.

There are many names that I respond to - Brock, hey you, dickhead, next - but none of them can be linked to pieces of paper with no identifying marks.  It's not as if baby switching and snatching never occur, so I cannot prove or disprove that any birth certificate is mine.  Neither can anyone else prove or disprove it (without a lot of exhumation and a lot of luck getting usable DNA from corpses).

The flip side is, I could claim any male certificate of live birth as my own.

Sam's situation is a childish game on the part of the bureaucrats.  They already know what they think they need to know, but they want him to vocalize a name to prove they can force him to do anything.

What if he vocalizes the name they want, and they continue the game just to see how much dance they can get out of the monkey?  Great, if that's your name, produce a birth certificate.  Prove that that is your birth certificate (INS challenges birth certificates all the time).  Produce familial DNA for comparison.  Produce a birth certificate for that person.  Prove that is their birth certificate.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

Would it be surprising that folks currently exhibiting immature behavior would continue that behavior?  Wouldn't it be more surprising if they didn't?
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"It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself."  ~ Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XVII, 1782. ME 2:222

blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #355 on: May 05, 2009, 11:32:09 AM »

Sam's situation is a childish game on the part of the bureaucrats.  They already know what they think they need to know, but they want him to vocalize a name to prove they can force him to do anything.
I would say it is childish on the part of Sam as well.

But in "our" system, Sam must to agree to the conditions of bail, and sign those conditions before they will let him go.

And what about the $10,000 cash bail? According to Ian, Sam can get out using the name "John Sam Doe" if he posts $10,000 bail. It sounds like he options besides giving up his name. But he would still need to agree to the conditions of bail.
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voodoo

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #356 on: May 05, 2009, 11:55:19 AM »

Sam's situation is a childish game on the part of the bureaucrats.  They already know what they think they need to know, but they want him to vocalize a name to prove they can force him to do anything.
I would say it is childish on the part of Sam as well.

But in "our" system, Sam must to agree to the conditions of bail, and sign those conditions before they will let him go.

And what about the $10,000 cash bail? According to Ian, Sam can get out using the name "John Sam Doe" if he posts $10,000 bail. It sounds like he options besides giving up his name. But he would still need to agree to the conditions of bail.

As I understand it, there are no bail conditions and none will be set until it puts the lotion on its skin.  It's incredibly naive to think that any bail conditions would be set, let alone reasonable ones once they get the monkey to dance "voluntarily".  It is far more likely the name Carl Drega will be invoked to justify indefinite incarceration.

As for Sam's childishness, I'm not sure how many guns you think he has in there, or how many people you think he has imprisoned, but I'm pretty sure the balance of power is not in his favor.  He may unrealistically believe that light will dawn on bureaucratic marble heads, but I think he probably knows that once he submits to mind rape they're not going to play "just the tip" with him.
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"It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself."  ~ Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XVII, 1782. ME 2:222

blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #357 on: May 05, 2009, 12:20:31 PM »

As I understand it, there are no bail conditions and none will be set until it puts the lotion on its skin.  It's incredibly naive to think that any bail conditions would be set, let alone reasonable ones once they get the monkey to dance "voluntarily".

From what I understand, most NH bail conditions are pretty standard. They are outlined in RSA Section 597:2


http://freekeene.com/2009/04/26/sam-update-phone-call-from-sam-help-get-him-on-freedom-watch/
From Ian on Sunday, April 26, 2009:
Quote
So, to get out of jail, he can either wait there and see what happens, pay $10,000 cash bail (which you can bet will have whatever fines he’s ordered to pay taken out of it after a trial, so this is the worst option), or give up his “legal name”, which may lead to a bail hearing and release on recognizance.

I guess he is going to "wait there and see what happens".
« Last Edit: May 05, 2009, 12:22:31 PM by blackie »
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blackie

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #358 on: May 05, 2009, 12:29:38 PM »

So...  I put my name on that form, because he won't.  
Just use "John Sam Doe" for a name.
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slayerboy

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Re: Group of activists arrested, Keene District Court April 13, 2009
« Reply #359 on: May 06, 2009, 11:49:58 AM »

1) can Burke imprison Sam forever so long as Sam refuses to ID himself?  I think not but I don't know the law on this issue.
This is the government we're talking about here.  They make up the rules as they go along.  It's like playing Monopoly and the banker always changing the rules of the Free Parking space.

2) if Sam wants to testify at his own trial, will he be required to ID himself in order to do so?  Would his continued refusal to ID himself result in the exclusion of his testimony?
As long as he refuses to ID himself, I highly doubt there will be a trial.

I'm slowly starting to come around and see what the point of all this was.  While I don't agree with it or how it all went down, the end result is the government is forcing their will on a person who doesn't wish their will imposed on.  With all of the other stuff that they have collected verifying his "legal name", there is NO reason why he should not have been released once they found out what his legal name is.

This is just a game of "who blinks first" between two goldfish and nothing more.  Sadly, I think Sam might end up losing this one due to his body shutting down from the hunger strike before the government gives in.
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