I have infinitely more respect for a drug dealer avoiding the law and taking care of business, than a bunch of people in NH holding signs and sitting in jail playing hero.
What about people like Denis Goddard, that are doing the political route?
I don't care about methods, I care about results.
If he's achieved anything, then i'll judge it on those results. Dennis seemed to be one of the more reasonable and pragmatic members of the FSP, although in recent discussion with him
over advertising FTL he declined to engage in any rational discussion over cost effectiveness of the methods.
I suggested ways where hundreds of dollars could be saved to achieve the same results, and the response I received was embarrassing considering that (to my knowledge) the promotion was funded by donations from other libertarians.
Now its possible I was incorrect, but as far as I can see my maths is sound and non of the people
who were involved in actually spending their time on promoting FTL bothered to prove what they were doing wasn't a waste of money compared to the alternatives.
anyway -- Certainly things have been achieved with local politics. Decriminalized cannabis in numerous states, prostitution, and a number of other freedoms.
However, the overwhelming majority of FSP supporters do not seem interested in discussing results, but rather are happy to mire themselves in meaningless platitudes like "all it takes is to touch one person", "you don't know its not having an effect" and "its better than doing nothing", or by addressing concerns over lack of results with hostility.
The whole "well what has a better chance than the FSP" argument is redundant. If FSP is accomplishing pretty much the same as nothing, how is it pretty much the same as nothing.
I don't understand.
The FSP has failed to instigate any increase in freedoms in New Hampshire since it was started. At most optimistic you could claim that the FSP has slowed down increases in slavery, even though theres no clear way of attributing it.
Suppose every anti-freedom law that got shot down was because of the FSP. So what? You're slowing the rate at which things get worse. On the current rate of movers, it will take many years before there are even 5,000 people in New Hampshire, still only 0.3% of a very small state (0.0001% of the national population). The original deadline was to shut down the FSP if it hadn't reached 20,000 signers (0.006% of national pop) by 2006 to avoid it becoming a drawn out sink hole of time and resources than never did anything.
Maybe those numbers were off, maybe we only need 1,000, but until any signs of progress start to be made, theres no reason to assume its working or will work. That's not how reason works. You don't assume something is correct just because you want it to, when you have nothing else to back up the belief.
Hell, I've heard people here sincerely claim that
"numbers don't matter", if they don't, why aren't huge changed being made with 700 people, why would any more people make a difference if numbers don't matter?
How you expect this to lead to "total freedom" is beyond me. Especially when the increases in Federal Government would make living in America less free, even if New Hampshire started improving (which it won't).
For the FSP just as a project for American libertarians to hang out, maybe push through weed decrim, maybe stop some bullshit laws going through, I think its a great idea (so long as you can't/won't leave america), but to go into it thinking complete freedom is in anyway possible in your lifetime is one of the most grossly unrealistic expectations I've heard from a libertarian.
I for one blame much of the madison avenue salesmanship that FSP members engage in, where they do the best to minimize any negative focus on the FSP, and play to peoples emotions and desire for freedom as much as possible.
When the 20,000 deadline wasn't hit? No problem, we don't need that many people anyway.
When 30% of the First 1000 failed to show up in the 2 year deadline? No problem, they'll be coming later.
When 8 years into the FSP there has not been any noticeable progress made and sign ups have slowed dramatically? Not a problem, its better than doing nothing, what else is there thats better? Eventually we'll hit a tipping point blah blah blah
When NH consistently gets more laws and taxes year after year? I don't know, you tell me.
Again, if you think my views are idiotic and not based on fact, feel free to make some money off that fact, I'll place money on a wager for a whole range of predictions.
The Free Talk Live BBS
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Topic: Free World Redux (Read 4046 times)