If there weren't government in the mix, you would not have had a problem with her actions, would you?
If the environment were such that there was hope for a calm, rational discussion about what's wrong with their controversial views without putting them in jeopardy just by the public outing alone, then no, I wouldn't. I still feel like really smart people are feigning ignorance about the mass hysteria that this subject invokes and all the potential repercussions.
So not even in a free society then, right? I mean, what you're saying is that a society without significant chance of retaliation against people with "Controversial views" must exist before this is an acceptable topic to even
discuss?
As for the repercussions of a dude admitting to be a pedophile on a planet where pedophilia is almost universally denounced are solely the responsibility of the dude and no one else, so far as I'm concerned. Dude knew what he was saying when he opened his mouth, right? No one is responsible for that but
him. HE publicly outed
himself.
There are no issues. There is no shit. There are controversial views. There is ZERO real evidence of any harm done to any child. As I understand it from hearing it from multiple first-hand sources, all we have is what they said and that included that they have not acted and that they don't intend to, and having controversial views is not a violation of anyone's rights.
It is however, perfectly valid that anyone with a kid near this dude, after he admits his... tastes, should be informed of them so that they can make their own choice about interacting with him, or letting their kid come near him. And for the record, he didn't say that he didn't intend to have sex with children. He said that he hadn't at this point, and when specifically asked about whether he had touched Summer's baby, he responded with (Accurate paraphrasing) "She's too young for my tastes, I like them between 6 and 8." Did you catch the implication in that statement?
Also, a point I'd like to make about "controversial views" - Pedophilia is no more a "controversial view" than homosexuality is. It is a state of brain chemistry due to development or genetics or whatever. The dude admits to sexual feelings toward children. He is a pedophile. That's what a pedophile is. It is not the action, it is the predilection.
Before my next statement I want to make clear that I am in NO WAY conflating being gay with being a pedophile. Nothing wrong with being gay at all.
Now - To prove the point about action vs. thought - You were gay before you ever had sex with a dude. You will surely admit this, yes? Having sex is not what defined your sexual tastes. It is not the action. It is
who you are. You're a gay guy. S'cool. But you'd still be gay whether or not you ever decided to have sex with a dude, right? You'd still be a gay guy if you closeted up and joined a church and married some woman who doesn't like sex anyhow and etc etc.
This dude expressed his desire to have sex with children. He's a pedophile. He admitted it fairly openly. That is who he is, whatever the reason. He also specifically said that children can consent. That
absolutely means that he saw no reason why it would be necessary to consult a parent when or if he decided to act on his sexual feelings. He even dropped the phrase "Anti ageist" into the convo.
That leads to the logical conclusion that if he decided to have sex with a child, he'd do it and he would be perfectly happy to hide it from the parents of the child, what with it not being any of their business, due to the child's ability to consent.
Now, there are fucking
shitpiles of scientific and social evidence that fucking a kid damages them. I don't think that this is even in dispute so I'm not gonna cite any of the thousands of studies out there. Fucking kids hurts kids. There's no controversy there. It's a supportable fact.
Long story short - This guy wants to fuck kids. Keep him away from kids or there is a greater than zero chance of them getting fucked. Knowing this is more valuable than his sense of privacy,
especially when he is willing to admit it in conversation. This is not some case where some creepy guy acted sorta creepy and people were worried about what he
might do. That I would totally agree qualifies as the witch hunt you were talking about. This is a
very specific case of a man expressing his desire to
do something.
Tell the whole fucking world as far as I'm concerned. Let it be known throughout the land. S'not my problem if as a result of his messed up brain and big mouth that the state starts paying attention to him. The fact that gooberment exists is a bummer, but I am not responsible for gooberment or its actions, and I'm not pretending ignorance either.
I think you might have a problem using free market solutions that overlap state monopolies because the state might intercede. Well, I dunno what to tell you about that beyond that I think that kids being exposed to pedophiles is worse to me than pedophiles being exposed to gooberment. Again, I wouldn't have done what she did. In some ways what I would have done is worse, by threatening the dude personally, but at least my threat would have been an if/then sort of affair. But I don't think she did anything worthy of what happened to her. She was treated like the perpetrator rather than the victim.
Bad choice for an example on my part. Obviously we all sympathize with the slaves, not to mention that I don't think the KKK overlaps with institutionalized slavery on the time line. A better example might be some pro-lifers posting the personal info of abortion doctors knowing that there are people out there ready and willing to assassinate them. I doubt even the pro-life folks here support that tactic.
But that isn't what happened. What happened is more akin to an abortion doctor sitting down with a pro-lifer and telling them all about how he's an abortion doctor who's never performed an abortion yet.
Of course that metaphor breaks down because there's nothing wrong with abortion and there IS something wrong with pedophilia. Pedophilia is bad.
They were sort of collectivist in that way, i.e. assuming all Free Keene folks were above the typical mainstream over-reaction to this subject.
Yeah, we disagree. I have been pretty damned rational in this discussion with you and I will continue to assert that there is no "Typical mainstream over-reaction" to pedophilia. That dude needs serious therapy and whatever other treatments exist/will exist and he needs to be kept away from children. Otherwise kids could get fucked just because he can't do without his favorite type of orgasm. That's small potatoes for him, but life changing damage for most kids.
Because he's not interested in help, people need to be informed so they can keep their kids away from him. Summer did that. I still see no problem here in her actions, man.
I have no idea what I'm supposed to be forgiving them for.
I was talking bad behavior in general, not this particular case.
I strongly disagree with them and would love a chance to talk to them and try to change their views.
I don't think anything either of us could say would be helpful. This is serious psychological shit that requires therapy. Sexual desire is not always rational, by nature, and debate doesn't change what causes a hardon.
I am quite willing to forgive Summer for reacting in a way that would likely bring harm to (for all we know) innocent people. (Note: It's my opinion that harm from her actions is very likely. I realize I've failed to convince you of that and I've more or less given up.)
Yeah, we disagree there. I think she ostracized some people good and proper, although I'd have done it differently. It would probably have ended in the same result if it were me, though. If I had told the dude right then and there that I was gonna tell everyone in the community what he'd just told me via word of mouth, they'd have bugged out just as quickly I think.
I don't doubt her sincerity and desire to do the right thing.
This we agree on.
The pedo-frenzy is a fairly modern phenomenon and I do think people will eventually calm down and be able to talk about it again with rational solutions in mind. All the emotionalism leads people to poor solutions.
Rational solution options to pedophilia are therapy and ostracism. The dude wasn't gonna do the therapy thing, man. He thought that his views were acceptable and rational. Ostracism was the only option left.
Kind of reminds me of the war on drugs. Some people are facing real problems related to drug abuse but the way we're trying to solve those is ineffective and often makes things much worse.
I don't see how. Being a drug addict doesn't
necessitate harming anyone but oneself.
Being a pedophile by its very nature
requires someone else to act upon if the temptation or whatever is too strong. I junkie can shoot up and lie in bed with no one getting hurt. A pedophile can't fuck a kid and not fuck a kid at the same time.
A cannot also be non-A.