Unofficial History of Drama in the Free State

[One two three]

It was an epic Facebook thread that got deleted.

It seems like you were not there and are unintentionally giving out wrong information.

[BonerJoe]

It was an epic Facebook thread that got deleted.

It seems like you were not there and are unintentionally giving out wrong information.

*DELETE BUTTON*

[sillyperson]

Apparently there are copies of said FB thread floating around.

Christ, I am glad that:
a) I don't live in Keene, and
b) have no idea who the hell these people are

[One two three]

It was an epic Facebook thread that got deleted.

It seems like you were not there and are unintentionally giving out wrong information.

*DELETE BUTTON*

So you were wrong, didn't correct your mistake even though I was nice about pointing it out and I'm the issue?

[BonerJoe]

It was an epic Facebook thread that got deleted.

It seems like you were not there and are unintentionally giving out wrong information.

*DELETE BUTTON*

So you were wrong, didn't correct your mistake even though I was nice about pointing it out and I'm the issue?

Keith, I know you love to play these games.

[blackie]

http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=22508.msg334332#msg334332

Ian:

It seems there are some frustrations posted here with the lowered popularity of the NHFree forum.  I'd like to speculate on why that is.  I think it's a convergence of several factors over time:

1.  Russell and Kat left Keene and moved to Grafton.  Russell and Kat were pioneers in this movement, and they took a lot of abuse at the hands of the state.  I don't blame them for wanting to get away from it all.   However, as a result of living in the woods, NHFree.com became less visible in activism videos and such.  Their move to Grafton effectively broke up the nucleus of the originals in the Keene area.  (Russell, Kat, Jim, Lauren, Roger, Elizabeth)  Without their regular activism at places like the Keene post office, the brand became less-relevant.

2.  Free Keene's forum.  There was debate at the time when the FK forum launched as to whether it was needed.  Coconut said no, I said I thought it was.  Turns out, it was the right choice to make.  Rather than one subforum of this forum, now Keeniacs and potential movers had a bevy of subforums all relating to the Keene area.  If I recall correctly, NHFree was created out of a similar "split".  It wasn't my intention to damage this forum, but only increase the discussion options for liberty lovers and decentralize the movement further.  However, clearly the Keene area-posts are there now instead of here.

3.  Russell and Kat left NH.  This one hurt for me... Russell and Kat were inspirational to me, and I know I'm not alone.  However, this site is their baby, and I'm sure it died a little more after they made the choice to leave.

4.  The rise of Facebook.  Clearly this one has already been addressed, and it's a biggie.  Whether you like it or not, that's where the bulk of the activist community is.  The facebook events are far better than a forum calendar for promotion.  As others pointed out, the social networking aspect makes promoting our ideas to new eyes more effective than just posting on a forum.  The market has spoken, and for the moment, FB is the place to be for activism organizing.  Again, there are ways to do it anonymously, so I guess I don't get that objection.

5.  Google calendar.  I shut off the FK forum calendar and replaced it with Google calendar.  CD Evolution is also using Google calendar.  It makes it so our activist events can automatically show up on smartphones and other people's personal calendars.  On the other hand, it means people need the forums less.

There are probably other reasons.  But those are some of the reasons that I use this forum less often, for what they are worth.

UPDATE - I thought of another one.

6.  The irrelevance of NHFree.com's main site.  The wiki was a cool idea originally, but never panned out into much.  The forum was (and is) always the draw to this site for me.  NHFree.com's main page is mostly static and so likely doesn't do much to build any consistent traffic to continue to visit the site.  Combined with the relative lack of promotion of the URL at activism events, when people DO come across NHFree.com, they enter the Underground to discover a confusing wiki with little fresh content.

...


still more:

7.  The social club aspect.  There were conversations a year or two ago by some of us in Keene about what was happening with the decline of NHFree.  The consensus was that it had morphed into a social forum for Russsell and Kat's friends.  It's likely this impression came about because of some of the above mentioned factors, most likely because of the lowered profile of NHFree due to Russell and Kat's reduced public role.  NHFree became a place to banter with others, but there just wasn't much activism being planned here.

8.  Success breeds success, and the reverse is true.  If you aren't expanding, you're dying.  The success and failure of NHFree does not soley ride on Russell and Kat, but they were certainly a big factor.  Many of these factors feed off of each other, resulting in a situation where the lowered visibility could be resulting in newer activists not even knowing about NHFree, meaning in many minds, NHFree just isn't on the radar.

Again, this site doesn't live or die based on Russell and Kat's participation in activism, but it is worth asking, *who* is out at activism events building the NHFree brand?  I was at the tilting at windmills event this weekend, and despite a good turnout, the only site url visible on signage was NHJury.com.  Roger was a key player in promoting the brand, but I don't recall the last time I saw a video from him.  Beyond that, *why* would anyone bother?  There are other, more active brands in play now, like NHJury, CDEvolution, FreeKeene.

If you are upset about the decline in popularity of this site, you only have yourself to blame.


...

Here's a perfect example of why people don't post here as often as in the past:
http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=22456.0

Wes posts notice of bringing back the Tilting at Windmills event and is rewarded for his efforts by being attacked by two forum moderators.  (Russell is the only mod who posts his appreciation.)

The atmosphere promoted in the above thread reenforces the idea that this is just a social club for the Kannings and friends.  Punish people verbally for bothering to come add value to this forum and watch as they never return.  

Tom Sawyer:

I had composed the following before seeing that Ian had continued ...
I can't at this point address all his points... and that is best for another thread or not at all.

Ian...
You specifically have said in the past that there is no privacy. Changing your position to fit the current need in the discussion is not something that only I have accused you of. I like to think that you fire from the hip sometimes and later have to refine your position.

We no longer attend the social sundays for several reasons...
Every weekend is too frequent, thus not knowing when is the best once a month choice (that we had in the past) means it just slipped out of our agenda.
The location was changing so frequently.
Not very entertaining for families.

As to families...
Michael's (great guy) group that was created doesn't require you to be a family, but does require you to be on Facebook. lol

Your show defending, and excusing kiddie diddlers seems to have attracted a few pervs to Keene.

The protest, such as 420 etc. have a vibe that our son doesn't want to do... he stood toe to toe with asshole cops in many locations... the hemp rallies in Boston, he had a great time. But the scruffly looking, loogy spitting, picking up other peoples cigarette butts to smoke people... all to the sounds of a bullhorn things seem to turn civilized folks off. lol I only slam that because of you beating the drum and promoting to icon status people that should have been watched from a wary distance.

Your analysis of the decline of activities that had attracted us to Keene has merit. I was pleased that someone was willing to take up the role of organizing things... You. I tried to participate on your forum, but you kept harping on the physical location aspect... I had been an activist in Keene for 5 + years, been going there for almost 20...
As I've stated already, anyone outside the geopolitical boundary was systematically excluded... Your "brand", and it's success, is the primary concern that drives your decisions. Russell, as example, wanted the movement, the issues to prevail... even if it was someone else's "franchise" that was the vehicle.

Your constant insistance that FreeKeene and the underground are in competition illustrates your model, which I contend is flawed.
Your social experiment of the FTL BBS was a failure, even though you were adamant that you were on the right path.

Back on the topic of FACEBOOK...  The ranking of that site...

The number one single right now...
E.T.  Katy Perry Featuring Kanye West  Teenage Dream
 ;D ;D ;D that is some awful shit... so the ranking among the mass audience is often not a good indicator. One of the things that made me realize that FACEBOOK was probably a bad direction was that every doofus is doing it now...  lol Of course it's all the latest craze for web developers...

The LP also thought we should model ourselves on what the major parties, biggest players did... that worked well.

[blackie]

I was listening to the Friday 04-01 show, and Ian said Rich Paul had taken a plea deal in Greenfeild MA.

He got a $300 fine. Did he pay it?

[sillyperson]

http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=22508.msg334332#msg334332

Tom Sawyer:

The protest, such as 420 etc. have a vibe that our son doesn't want to do... he stood toe to toe with asshole cops in many locations... the hemp rallies in Boston, he had a great time. But the scruffly looking, loogy spitting, picking up other peoples cigarette butts to smoke people... all to the sounds of a bullhorn things seem to turn civilized folks off. lol I only slam that because of you beating the drum and promoting to icon status people that should have been watched from a wary distance.

Yep.

I always liked that guy.

[BonerJoe]

Free Staters Drop the Ball on Child Predators~!!!!!!!
by Summer Jamie Aspen on Thursday, March 31, 2011 at 7:58pm
Pedophile alert in the Free State Community...by Summer Jamie Aspen on Tuesday, March 29, 2011 at 8:30pm
I was asked to take this down and called in by Ian to a community meeting starting at 2:30 in the morning going until 5 am. Ian and Hunter were not at all about the issues surrounding the welfare of the child who's parents believe that having sexual relations with children of any age can be voluntary on the child’s part and is okay.  All they cared about is that someone might have saw my post that could call cps.  The trade off for deleting the post is that nic and lynze could talk to a therapist friend of mine in the free state community over Skype.  Immediately after the conversation began Ian wanted to end it because his business of getting my post removed was done.  The only help these people might ever get was right then talking to Wes. 
I am scared for the safety of Kaius and other children in the community after learning that nic and Lindsey believe that it is okay to have sexual relations with children so long as the child is okay with it. Nic admitted to being attracted to children particularly young girls starting around age 8 and admitted to being a pedophile who has not acted on it yet except for mildly questionable actions with his son like letting his son fondle his penis in the shower. How he came to telling me this was after an entire days conversation on Sunday about children and sexuality...i was trying the whole day to find the best argument for why it's not okay to be sexual with a child even if they begged for it. I explained it can never be voluntary because of the power differential and because children are not in a voluntary situation as kids. He said pleasuring kids sexually if it makes them happy is the same as painting with them or playing soccer with them.
 
After this day long conversation nic and Lyndsey went into town for social Sunday at the V-bar.  I stayed home so i could call my brother and discuss all my concerns with him...we then did a three way conversation with Wes Bertrand. They confirmed my argument about how it is unjustifiable period to try and rationalize adults having sex with kids. Lyndsey and Nic came home as i was finishing up talking to Wes. Lyndsey did not realize what nic and i were talking about all day as she was talking to jake (who happen to catch part of the conversation and told me to read about the ancient Greeks and how being sexual with kids was not bad...but i said nor was it in the best interest of the child) another new free stater while Nic and i were chatting.
 
Lyndsey realized that i knew about her and Nic's family secret when i confronted him asking if he has ever touched my daughter on her privates..he said no and reassured me that he is not attracted to babies, just little girls. Lyndsey was appalled and very upset that Nic admitted to me that he was a pedophile. I asked if he would schedule a discussion with Wes Bertrand the next night to help him understand what could be wrong with his psychology that he would find the idea of having 'voluntary' sex with children and even his own kids okay. he said yes he would chat with Wes. That is until Lyndsey became very upset with Nic that he wanted to get help because she doesn't believe there is anything wrong with this voluntary sex with young people either. She thinks it's ageism to put a label on what age you can or can't have sex.
 
Because Lyndsey was so angry and scared that she could lose Kaius if this info got into the wrong hands..i reassured her that i would not call cps and that i wouldn't tell their secret. i don't believe in cps..i think that cause in some cases more damage than abusive parents can with their government program. I don't believe cps in the answer to this issue..but i do believe community is. I am hoping that the free state community can come together in a meeting with Nic and Lyndsey to try and help them understand that this is one area of belief that they have truly dropped the ball. As free starters i believe we are more open to unconventional ideas and ways of life than most people but in the area of child sex with adults most free starters would find this equally appalling and be able to help Nic and Lyndsey come to their senses with a more rational argument than even i could offer them.
 
I called jj that night at about two in the morning to find other living arrangements. he came over the next morning and was confirmed by Nic and Lyndsey themselves that what i told him that night about what was going on with them is true. James Schlesinger was not able to knock any more sense into this idea of theirs that it could be very possible that an 8 year old girl could be mature enough and ready for sex may it be with her father or another older male adult. So we left and that was that.

[BonerJoe]

I spent the day yesterday trying to regroup from this whole new situation i am in with this knowledge i just learned about these two. I pretty much moved out here to create an intentional community of our own with these two with "unconditional parenting" and "unschooling" as the grounds of our parenting philosophy. I don't know anywhere in either of those philosophies that it talks about having sex with our kids. I have been trying to figure out how to present this and whether or not to present this to the community. I know that i feel incredibly duped and deceived to find out that they are pro pedophilia after coming here to live with them and Lindsey never planned to tell me ever!! If this conversation had of never come up I guess it would have be nic trying to have sex with my daughter once she was attractive to him and as long as she didn't say no!! this does not meet my need for honesty, integrity, communication, nor safety. because I feel so scared about what if have just learned and wish I had of known this before entrusting my daughter with them... I know that if they are not going to tell other families so that they can make educated decisions when hanging out with them then it is my social responsibility to expose this secret that could be hazardous to children!!
 
Please call me xxx-xxx-xxxx. I would rather everyone get to talk to nic and lyndsey about this in person and hear their argument themselves and everyone a chance to have a voice to express their concerns to them as a village would do.
 ~summer

Jeremy Sterling Frandsen and Eric Shuman like this.50 of 126
Scott Bieser Ian, I think it might be fruitful to have a discussion with someone like Stefan Molyneaux regarding child sexuality, if you want to have that sort of discussion.5 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman I have no interest in taking this discussion beyond this comment thread, Scott. I don't claim to know anything about raising kids, and will not pass judgement against people who deviate from the "norm", whatever that is. I only would judge those who are using force against their children.5 hours ago ·
Jeremy Sterling Frandsen If a child of 8 has sex with an adult it is force based on the very one side balance of power. How on earth could an 8 year old say no to the one that keeps you alive, you need to read up on child psychology a bit, holy hell...5 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Amen Jeremy... and Ian what kind of freak are you? Going off your post a few minutes ago.. first of all it's very apparent you don't have any kids so let me spell something out for you Ian, ALL THAT SHIT IS WRONG!!!! You don't have sex with... your kids or in front of your kids, and you don't watch porn with your kids... and yes it is your business if you know someone is having sex with a child and do nothing you are just a s guilty! You think I was being barbaric, you haven't seen anything sugar britches, I catch someone molesting or raping my 8 y/o daughter then you would see "Barbaric" they would be severely tortured before they died...See More5 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman ‎@Ian your best bet at this point is to stop theorizing about something you know nothing about before you dig yourself into the deepest hole you've ever known. You are not helping the cause of liberty by treading down this supposed path of principled liberty. It's something you know absolutely nothing about and the more you post the deeper you dig yourself into this hole. It's not one you will be able to dig out of and it will be of your own doing...no violence necessary.5 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman Guess you haven't been listening long, Griffyn. We've talked about issues like this on-the-air before. I suppose you supported it when the texas state troopers kidnapped 400+ children from the FLDS cult?4 hours ago ·
Jason Osborne There is a difference between "force" and being a willful enabler of mental and physical damage to another person. If someone jumps off a roof in front of you, no, you did not "force" them. If, however, the jumper is a child in your custody... and you did nothing to stop them, then you have f*d up. If, further, the child asks you to throw them off the roof and you agree, then you are even more-so to be judged.
You know full well the potential damage that will result. Hey, you may say, there is a chance he won't break a single bone. Reason and evidence, however, causes us to expect that most likely injuries will abound.
"I jumped off a roof one time and am totally fine" is no excuse to sanction the wholesale throwing of children off roofs by their custodians, in willful ignorance of the countless piles of broken bones and tortured souls.See More4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman Lou, I think I made it clear earlier - I don't claim to know anything about this issue. I do not support sex with children, however I won't support using anything greater than ostracism against these folks.4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel It's interesting how people sit behind a computer or on air in your case and talk shit thinking they will never

[BonerJoe]

be held accountable for running their mouths, isn't that right Ian...did it ever occur to you that somebody who was such a psych...opath and so barbaric as you put it would be able to easily track you down if I wanted too...and remember this Liberty boy if it wasn't for me and others like me who sacrificed and served our Country in The Military, you would have no Liberties... so the next time your running your mouth make yourself useful and Thank a Vet!See More4 hours ago ·
Jason Osborne There's a surprise.4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman It seems people are upset with me because I won't jump to the conclusion that these parents, who seem to be genuinely caring people, are damaging their child through their unusual method of raising their son. Seems to me to be a commentary on the pervasiveness of sexual repression in American society. There are many cultures where parents and children live in the same room, and the parents have sex in front of their children. To you, that is abuse, to them, that's normal.4 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman ‎@Ian unfortunately, your not making your case very well and you're painting yourself into a corner when dealing with parents of children. Let me give you an example of your current position: http://funnybackgroundpictures.com/files/2010/12/Mamma-Bear.jpg4 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman Try to reason with that...good luck ;)4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman What case, Lou? My case is that Summer should inform people privately about this matter. These parents are now scared that crazed people are out to kill them as a result of this public post. I doubt that was Summer's intention in making this post, but that is what has happened.4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Bullshit Ian, that's the equivalent of saying abortion needs to be legal in case of incest or rape which is .001 % of the times, meanwhile there are 500 million abortions a year in the U.S. were not talking about a family living in a one room grass hut in Africa who have no choice so don't try and twist shit around, were talking about a guy and his wife who straight up say there is nothing wrong with having sex with an 8 y/o child...4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman I think there is something wrong with having sex with children, but these people have not done that and no one has alleged they have, yet people are threatening their lives.4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel They have not done it yet but they said they would if they had the chance and who threatend their life?4 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman Well, when you put yourself in the path of danger, given all of the evidence that there is danger involved in the path you've chosen, then danger is to be expected. There is no freedom without responsibility. Freedom does not exist without consequence. Choose whatever freedom you desire, but deal with the consequences that come with it or get the fuck out :)4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Ian are you a pacifist?4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman Michael, you may want to review the earlier post you made where you threatened to break his neck.4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman No, Michael.4 hours ago ·
Jason Osborne In some places it is normal to circumcise baby girls. Abuse or no?
This is not about jumping to conclusions and sexual repression. This is about paying attention to the multitudinous volumes of health science pertaining to this topic.
So on o...ne hand we have Mr. Kill Team dying to pose with mommy and daddy's corpses while on the other we have Koosh Barbrady wanting us to "move along, nothing to see here".See More4 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman No one has threatened anyone's lives...unless the actual action occurs. Action > Reaction. It's an "If/Then" statement. Consequence for action. Pretty straight forward.4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Ian, that was said in the context if I had been in Summers place...4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Jason, do you mean female castration?4 hours ago ·
Lucio Saverio Eastman And I guarantee, as a parent of 5 children, "if" someone violates my minor children, "then" they will suffer violence at my hand.4 hours ago ·
Jason Osborne http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_cutting4 hours ago ·
Kris Bro I dont know whats more disgusting anymore, your average military man, or a pedophile.4 hours ago ·

[BonerJoe]

Michael Meisel Jason, yes you did mean female castration and when you say normal I don't know if I agree with that having been to countries that practice this barbaric ritual and yes it's abuse...4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Hey Kris Bro, Blow Me!4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman Yes - that's clearly abuse. It's using force against a child. I'm not saying move along. I'm saying yes, please tell other parents this info, but don't scatter shot it across the whole internet where people inclined to violence such as the police may be lurking.4 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt Probably no libertarian i reckon. Anyway if he has those feelings for children it's his problem, when he makes it someone else his/her problem i fully agree with blowing the dingleberries off the twig.4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Who keeps erasing my posts dammit!4 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel ‎"If anarchy means no law, then anarchy is a silly, Utopian, fantasy. Who here would not stop a man from raping a woman right in front of your face? Well, that's anarchist law being enforced. By stopping a rapist, does one become an arch? I think not. By enforcing the "Thou shalt not rape" law, one is restoring anarchy, because anarchy is peace!3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel Thanks for the loan Kris Bro...3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt If anarchy means no law, then anarchy is a silly, Utopian, fantasy: It simply means no leaders of no authority. It doesnt mean that a community can not make their own police force. It does not mean everyone becomes a maniac firing guns at random an in almost a piraty way looting and raping amock, thats hollywood, not anarchy.3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel and dangerous too Hoc...3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt ‎@michael whats dangerous? i am all for anarchy.. Human nature is of itself not violant and immoral, it has to be conditioned that way. Like the state does. In anarchy the state is absent and no one can plunder legaly. This does not mean that a police force of some kind is not present... There might aswel be one, because people want it.. it's still anarchy, not the one hollywood stuffs in your brain.3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel everyone becomes a maniac firing guns at random an in almost a piraty way looting and raping amock, that's what I said was dangerous too Hoc...3 hours ago ·
Kayleena Ali Sepulveda come back to utah!!!we miss you!!!!!!3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt It is michael, but thats not anarchy the way i know it to be.but this scenario will not happen spontaniously when state and law are gone. Bastiat said it well in his book "he law"It is not that people are moral because there is the law, it'...s because they are moral that they made the law. It only backfired because some immoral individuals used the law to sanction legal plunder and opression by the state. Anarchy is simple, if youi want protection you can hire anyone you like to do it for you. The wild west scenes from robocop and other movies portray anarchy in a very bad and fictional way.... thats not what anarchy entails, it's just as many things a hollywood fantasySee More3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt ‎@Kayleena Wish i could goto utah, or anywhere in the states for that matter... Sick of communist Netherlands. Just that bloody greencard.... damn.. at least you guy's there have some sense of liberty3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel I disagree with you on that statement Hoc "Human nature is of itself not violant and immoral it has to be conditioned that way, based on the Bible, and the fact that we have a sin nature...human nature is violent and has been since the fall in the garden...3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel That theory that we are all basically good in our hearts is a huge lie... it says so in the Bible Hoc3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt Michael other than the fact that i disagree with you on the religious part... If people are as a matter of fact sinful and immoral, I WOULD NOT EVEN DARE HAVE THEM IN A STATE.... it's a falacious circle realy.
If people are moral we do not ...need a state, if they are not i dare not have one.
Thats why anarchy is the only moral option and only logical option to make . Why is people are imoral and seek out a masacre, would we give a small group power over everyone that consist of the same attributes? It's a fallacy and a fairytale you've been told, face it. Just take the variables and see to what conclusions you can come... It almost in every case results in anarchy being the best and moral option.See More3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt Michael, sorry but if i write down in a book and pass it down for 2000 hyears that someday humans will grow elephant ears and duck beaks, that does not make it true...It's a book, nothing more...3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel I hear you guys are having some issues with the Muslim immigrants in The Netherlands, care to Comment

[BonerJoe]

Hoc?3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel So your saying The BIble isn't true Hoc, do you believe in GOD?3 hours ago ·
Michael Meisel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyNCrZx9E4Q3 hours ago ·
Hoc Voluerunt ‎@michael, yes we have problems with muslim immigrants.. alot of them dont speak the language and come directly in the welfare state to be taken care of by the politicians, they mostly contribute nothing and lawsuits allaround becausde they... feel discriminated on every turn. ... It's pathetic really but the state perpetuates it
About GOD.. I do not believe in god, that does not make my arguments any less valid though. Sure there could be some historical truth in the bible, or even some good moral lesson, but it's because humans are moral that they wrote this morality down in the bible to begin with.See More3 hours ago ·
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50 of 55
Summer Jamie Aspen How are you not like members of a catholic church covering up sick actions of their sick members.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Like JJ said..lot's of people don't like you and it's for a good reason not because i have talked any trash about you.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen So you tradded sex for video games at age 10 with a 16 year old. And JJ said you think what people do with their kids is their business. How do you think that you are alright Ian?
5 hours ago ·
James Schlessinger Jr speak for yourself, Summer.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen do i think we could all use a lot of therapy YES!! But people touching children sexually should have them taken away and THEN seek help.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen It's this multigenerational ill treatment that leads to more messed up adults like Ian, you, and quite possibly me
5 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman You're twisting my words. I made it clear it was bad to post this publicly and you seemed to understand why. I only supported you informing people privately, and I think you are misinforming them privately.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen But id say i am the much healthier person searching for reason and logic to make my decisions of what's right and wrong..and fighting for childrens right to not be sexually abused by adults who think it's just voluntary on the kids behalf!!!
5 hours ago ·
James Schlessinger Jr you're twisting my words as well, to suit your heroic fantasy.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen yeah sure james you were there trying to convince Nic why it wasn't okay to touch children sexually the day you came to pick me up. What words exactly am i twisting!!
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen You were all there when they described why it's perfectly fine for them to let Kaius touch nics penis
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen I had immense social pressure to delete the post and nic and lindze wouldn't stay and talk to wes if i didn't. If i have to lie about deleting a post to get child predators some help i think that's pretty admirable eh??
5 hours ago ·

[BonerJoe]

James Schlessinger Jr yeah, Wes B pressured you to take it down.
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen the fact that i was being pressured to take down my post for your numbers Ian is not virtue in the least.. i don't owe sick people honesty!!
5 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Wes bertrand didn't pressure me to go to the Community Activist Center at 2:30 in the morning with my tired baby girl to argue with child predators to take down a post warning people about it!!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen That was Ian!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Wes Bertrand only offered his oppinion and he was scared about an individuals violent suggestionl..so was i at that moment.
4 hours ago ·
James Schlessinger Jr i guess Wes was wrong to ask you to take it down
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Yes he was james..he was thinking purely Non Violent Communication..HE WASN'T THINKING CONTEXT!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen THE CONTEXT IS GET THE KID SAFE BEFORE ANYTHING!!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Before worrying about me sharing valid information with people we should have all been thinking of getting Kaius away from sick parents!!!
4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman If you are accusing me of supporting sexually touching children, you are mistaken.
4 hours ago · · 1 personLoading...
Ian Freeman Robert, your response is indicative of why she should not have posted this. You have no idea what you are talking about. No one has had sex with children, period.
4 hours ago · · 1 personLoading...
James Schlessinger Jr I find child sex abhorrent and I believe Wes had said more about the facebook post than simply the violence. I believe Wes provided some wisdom about this and found his decision to take it down valuable.
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Well Ian where was that conviction when you had the chance to talk to these people..why didn't you tell them not to have sex with children period while you had the chance!!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen You and Hunter were flat out supporting them! I can see you are back peddling on your beliefs now like they were now that this is a public matter again!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen ‎@ James..Why didn't you give that oppinion to the pedophiles while you had the chance
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Why were you all babying them and passifying frears and irrationality them with playing nice and understanding. Id say they needed a little laying down of truth by their community. Now they are gone and they believe you were all on their side being ambiguous about child sexuality appropriateness!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Sure Ian you are so conscerned about violence against adults like robert is talking about in dealing with this sick of parents..but you are not conscerned about what people do with their kids. SO you think having sex with kids is wrong..but you don't do something about it when you find out people who believe it is right and r actively starting in their childs sexual ventures together!!
4 hours ago ·
James Schlessinger Jr i did, multiple times, perhaps that does not suit your story, perhaps that makes

[BonerJoe]

me less of a villain than I need to be. Perhaps you are taking on a selective memory so you can simply collectivize and condemn all freestaters.
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Also James..why don't you tell people why you really ostresized me today..when all i told you was i think i should have called cps. I was already told that i wasn't allowed at the KAC before i reposted this so IAN IS THE LIAR Here..He ostresized me also before i even reposted this and is just using this as an excuse to sound more noble.
4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman I didn't have to tell them not to have sex with their child, because they AREN'T. His son touched his penis in the shower and said "pee-pee". Completely natural, nothing sexual about that. You are exaggerating this situation and libeling these people who have never harmed anyone.
4 hours ago · · 1 personLoading...
Summer Jamie Aspen Ian and James are fine with telling pedophiles that they are still welcome in the community and trying to get them to stay..but a REAL ACTIVIST taking action to warn the community and try and get the community together to do something is then OSTRESIZED for posting it publically and having the belief that CPS would have done more justice than i saw the community do.
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen What about everything they admited about having full intention of being sexual with their child Ian. Even thought the pp incident is all that has been told to us that they've done so far. And yes James saw them arguing for pro-having sex with children the day he came to pick me up. Once they know i'm onto them and getting their "secret" out to the public they are gonna start back peddaling!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen yeah sure thats exaclty what i want to do is condemn all free staters.
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen There happens to be a lot of free staters that were very happy i publically posted and one that like michele seven who were really willing to do something about it!
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen Yes james..i remember you telling them not to mess with other peoples kids.
4 hours ago ·
Summer Jamie Aspen but you u also told them how much you still like them and wouldn't expose their secret to anyone else to make them feel better..james
4 hours ago ·
James Schlessinger Jr babying them? it is called compassion, a shade of love. You have much left to learn, Jamie.
4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman I'd already decided to ostracize you before you posted this, Summer. I just hadn't talked to you yet. I'm ostracizing you because you trash-talked me to other people after I supported you and spoke of calling cps. JJ will happily refund your $5 membership fee I'm sure, but please keep your drama away from the KAC.
4 hours ago ·
Ian Freeman You lie or misinform at least twice in your first paragraph, Summer. I did not call the meeting. I was asked to attend by Nic and Lyndz. Also, I didn't call it over after you removed the post, that was hours later after a lengthy conversation. We were tired, it was late. We didn't leave until 6am and started around 2am.
4 hours ago ·
Mike Ruff I understand your concern. I agree that if you think someone is doing something wrong, you should pass the word. HOWEVER, your issue is with certain individuals, and not having spoken to all Participants in the FSP about this, I don't see how it is constructive or correct to say "Free Staters Drop the Ball..." Nor do I think it is correct to make such an allegation against the FSP in a public forum.
4 hours ago · · 3 peopleLoading...
Michele Seven
‎"I explained it can never be voluntary because of the power differential and because children are not in a voluntary situation as kids." I agree. I also believe that FB was the wrong forum. I emphatically state that I completely am able to... be compassionate in a way with Summer since I too was a mother of a 1-year-old