Welcome to the Free Talk Live bulletin board system!
This board is closed to new users and new posts.  Thank you to all our great mods and users over the years.  Details here.
185859 Posts in 9829 Topics by 1371 Members
Latest Member: cjt26
Home Help
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  General
| | |-+  Boner Joe Owes Me Money
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8   Go Down

Author Topic: Boner Joe Owes Me Money  (Read 26298 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Cognitive Dissident

  • Amateur Agorist
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3916
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #60 on: December 30, 2011, 11:58:52 AM »

You can say whatever the fuck you want to, and I can disagree with you.  How about that?
Logged

alaric89

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1842
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #61 on: December 30, 2011, 12:47:21 PM »

Absolutely sir.
Everyone else thinks grifters and loansharks should have free rein to suckering ignorant or desperate people into nasty contracts?
Once libpar is established, I can put out a bid for the manufacture of the security doors on that debtors prison we will need.
Silver lining and all that.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 01:30:45 PM by alaric89 »
Logged

Bill Brasky

  • Emperor of Wisdom
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 553
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #62 on: December 30, 2011, 02:02:57 PM »


Once libpar is established, I can put out a bid for the manufacture of the security doors on that debtors prison we will need.
Silver lining and all that.

Oh good, a new word has entered the lexicon of the ridiculous. 
Logged

Tom Foppiano

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 277
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #63 on: December 30, 2011, 02:50:09 PM »

I don't think this deal is "one sided" against the borrower. He didn't even pay back the principle.

And there are a lot of people who think that ANY level of interest is immoral. We can't just pick a number and claim that all loans should be x apr or less.

The only fair interest rate is the one decided on by the lender and borrower.

The fact that some statists will whine about "one sided deals" just shows their economic ignorance. There will always be those who see exploitation in every transaction. If there is any exploitation here, it is due to the default not the interest rate.

PS Would you see this deal as "one sided" or exploitative, if the lender loaned the money at 0%? Probably not. We'd all say, "Oh how nice of Coconut to help out a friend." Not, "OMG! Coconut is being EXPLOITED! AHHHHH!"

Just shows the inherent bias many of us have against lenders.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 02:53:13 PM by Tom Foppiano »
Logged
It might not be very big around, but it sure is short!

Cognitive Dissident

  • Amateur Agorist
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3916
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #64 on: December 30, 2011, 03:23:23 PM »

Absolutely sir.
Everyone else thinks grifters and loansharks should have free rein to suckering ignorant or desperate people into nasty contracts?
Once libpar is established, I can put out a bid for the manufacture of the security doors on that debtors prison we will need.
Silver lining and all that.

Walter Block: Defending the Undefendable.  Read it.

Only the two people participating in a transaction get to decide if the transaction should take place.
Logged

alaric89

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1842
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #65 on: December 30, 2011, 03:39:36 PM »

My experience with dishonest, yet "legal" dealers makes me a bit watchful of contract happy devils. I am not arguing against Coconut, what I am doing is arguing for is a reputation check and balance on both sides of a contract. I don't think having full unquestioning respect for any signed contract is a good idea. To be honest I have trouble getting through those licence agreements on the net. I can have agreed to give up my soul for all I know.
I would be more comfortable with one overseen from a third party arbitrator, if I was looking at a contract between two individuals.
I have no desire to live in a society where the biggest prick will just rise to the top through cleverly contracted graft.

Cognitive Dissident

  • Amateur Agorist
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3916
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #66 on: December 30, 2011, 03:55:16 PM »

My experience with dishonest, yet "legal" dealers makes me a bit watchful of contract happy devils. I am not arguing against Coconut, what I am doing is arguing for is a reputation check and balance on both sides of a contract. I don't think having full unquestioning respect for any signed contract is a good idea. To be honest I have trouble getting through those licence agreements on the net. I can have agreed to give up my soul for all I know.
I would be more comfortable with one overseen from a third party arbitrator, if I was looking at a contract between two individuals.
I have no desire to live in a society where the biggest prick will just rise to the top through cleverly contracted graft.

You don't think the biggest prick will lose most of his business when everyone finds out he's the biggest prick?
Logged

alaric89

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1842
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #67 on: December 30, 2011, 04:05:00 PM »

Of course not. He will go crazy with unchecked power just like almost everyone else does. Get the hired guns, game over.
Human greed is alive and well. Contracts need a third party validation or we will have to have once a decade rich people hunts.

http://mises.org/books/defending.pdf
WTFK's reading assignment.
Non violent pimps. That is pretty funny.

Diogenes The Cynic

  • Cynic. Pessimist. Skeptic. Jerk.
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3727
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #68 on: December 30, 2011, 06:05:19 PM »

I see a couple of problems here. It doesn't seem as if the parties here had designated an arbiter in case of a fallout. In the contract, it should have been written that "by x time, if the money had not yet been paid back, then the case goes in front of so-and-so third party, with <person> paying for it."

Another thing here is that not all contracts can or should be legally binding. Would you argue that if Coconut could take a pound of flesh from BonerJoe if he defaulted? But but they agreed to it.................... Yeah fucking right.

I think a contract should not be legally binding if it the case that it was written with the intent that the borrower could not understand the terms.
Logged
I am looking for an honest man. -Diogenes The Cynic

Dude, I thought you were a spambot for like a week. You posted like a spambot. You failed the Turing test.

                                -Dennis Goddard

hellbilly

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6664
  • Pogue Mahone.
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #69 on: December 30, 2011, 07:10:11 PM »

I posted something here I think about that interest rate I think.. in case I wasn't super clear - I don't blame Coconut whatsoever. BJ named the rate.
Logged
Give me Liberty or give me Meth!

"We are profoundly dissatisfied with pretty much everything but we canít articulate why, and are unable to offer any viable alternative." - Nathaniel Weiner

John Shaw

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17244
    • View Profile
    • Think Twice Productions
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #70 on: December 30, 2011, 07:34:27 PM »

Coconut expressed his concerns about non-payment and Bonerjoe was up front and clearly expressed Intent To Pay in a forthright and honest and open way.

Sometimes people don't have the money they owe. Good people pay it when they can and make reparations for the additional strain put onto the debt owner. Bad people usually skate town or otherwise disappear. So far Bonerjoe has been behaving in a manner consistent with the first type of person.

Bummer for Coconut to not have his money, of course, but what more can ya do? S'not like the debt is being denied. Dude just doesn't have the scratch.

I don't see the controversy with any of this.
Logged
"btw its not a claim. Its documented fact."

alaric89

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1842
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #71 on: December 31, 2011, 06:57:22 AM »

That is a interesting point.

sillyperson

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5196
  • Free the Mallocs!
    • View Profile
    • NH Liberty Alliance
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #72 on: December 31, 2011, 11:08:58 AM »

BJ borrowed $10,000. So far he has only paid $7885 back.
Wait... he's paid back nearly 80% of the principal? And he says he's trying to make good on the remainder of the principal-plus-renegotiated-interest?

From OT I'd have thought this was a total-default situation.
It's not.

Seems to me it's a very manageable situation.

Tom Foppiano

  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 277
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #73 on: December 31, 2011, 09:00:14 PM »

What the fuck would a "third party arbitrator" do for these guys?

Arbitrators help settle disputes and there is no dispute.


And what is this borrower didn't understand the terms of the contract nonsense? Hmmmm You borrow $5k (making up numbers) today and you pay back $7.5k in 120 days. How much clearer could this have been?

"Oh, but you don't see that this is a bad deal for the borrower. He's being EXPLOITED! He needs a third party to run his financial affairs because he's TOO FUCKING DUMB to live his own life."
Logged
It might not be very big around, but it sure is short!

Diogenes The Cynic

  • Cynic. Pessimist. Skeptic. Jerk.
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3727
    • View Profile
Re: Boner Joe Owes Me Money
« Reply #74 on: December 31, 2011, 09:06:45 PM »

What the fuck would a "third party arbitrator" do for these guys?

Arbitrators help settle disputes and there is no dispute.


And what is this borrower didn't understand the terms of the contract nonsense? Hmmmm You borrow $5k (making up numbers) today and you pay back $7.5k in 120 days. How much clearer could this have been?

"Oh, but you don't see that this is a bad deal for the borrower. He's being EXPLOITED! He needs a third party to run his financial affairs because he's TOO FUCKING DUMB to live his own life."

Negotiate a timeline for repayment.

You didn't seem to understand the rest of what I said.
Logged
I am looking for an honest man. -Diogenes The Cynic

Dude, I thought you were a spambot for like a week. You posted like a spambot. You failed the Turing test.

                                -Dennis Goddard
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8   Go Up
+  The Free Talk Live BBS
|-+  Free Talk Live
| |-+  General
| | |-+  Boner Joe Owes Me Money

// ]]>

Page created in 0.026 seconds with 32 queries.