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[Taors]

Hate your entire family or you're a bad, misled person.

In fact, it was FDR that gave me the clarity to dump my douchebag of a mom (I still talk with my sisters...they are pretty cool).

[theodorelogan]

???

[BonerJoe]

I guess the sex must have been terrible.

[Rusty Nut]

That isn't the stand of FDR at all.  From my understanding, Stefan believes that we should love/respect people for the virtues a person has, not a title they hold.  If your family is a bunch of jerks, you shouldn't associate with them JUST because they are family.  You are just making yourself a victim if you do.  In fact, it was FDR that gave me the clarity to dump my douchebag of a mom (I still talk with my sisters...they are pretty cool).

You realize how culty you sound right?  And how completely anti-individualist that statement is, how can I possibly "make myself a victim"?

[theodorelogan]

You realize how culty you sound right?  And how completely anti-individualist that statement is, how can I possibly "make myself a victim"?

Could you explain to me what about that statement sounds "culty"?

As far as "making myself a victim", yes you are correct.  I could have chosen a more exact phrase.  The point though is that I continued to put myself in situations where my mom could abuse be a dick to me (by visiting her), and so I decided to stop contacting her.  Certainly, it isn't your fault if an asshole is an asshole all the time, but that doesn't mean it isn't stupid to keep putting yourself into the situation.

Where you raped as a kid or something?

No, but she hit me.  And verbally abused me as well.  So first off, I don't really want to associate with people who hit children 1/4 their size.  That's sick.

But even now, I get zero value from our relationship.  She thinks I am a nutcase for having these crazy "anarchy" ideas, which is a problem since liberty is one of the most important things in my life.  Anytime I bring up anything remotely political she shuts me down instantly.  One time, she started screaming at me because I was lending my sister "The Virtue of Selfshness" (BTW I am not a Randian anymore).  She also told me that I deserved to be in prison for selling pot.  Certainly I have relationships with people who are not anarchists, but I have removed pretty much everyone who is virulently statist (or completely closed-minded to liberty) from my life.

There is no way I would associate with someone like this who was not a family member...and since I don't view simply being a family member as being valuable in and of itself, I chose to dissociate myself from her.

At first I felt guilty about it...but then I realized that if she had any redeeming qualities (an engaging personality, an open mind, treated me halfway decently, etc) then this wouldn't be a problem.  If she doesn't, then why waste any time with her?  I have too many wonderful people in my life that deserve my attention to waste any on someone like her.

Is rape the only reason you would choose to dissociate yourself from someone?

[BonerJoe]

No, but she hit me.  And verbally abused me as well.  So first off, I don't really want to associate with people who hit children 1/4 their size.  That's sick.

But even now, I get zero value from our relationship.  She thinks I am a nutcase for having these crazy "anarchy" ideas, which is a problem since liberty is one of the most important things in my life.  Anytime I bring up anything remotely political she shuts me down instantly.  One time, she started screaming at me because I was lending my sister "The Virtue of Selfshness" (BTW I am not a Randian anymore).  She also told me that I deserved to be in prison for selling pot.  Certainly I have relationships with people who are not anarchists, but I have removed pretty much everyone who is virulently statist (or completely closed-minded to liberty) from my life.

There is no way I would associate with someone like this who was not a family member...and since I don't view simply being a family member as being valuable in and of itself, I chose to dissociate myself from her.

At first I felt guilty about it...but then I realized that if she had any redeeming qualities (an engaging personality, an open mind, treated me halfway decently, etc) then this wouldn't be a problem.  If she doesn't, then why waste any time with her?  I have too many wonderful people in my life that deserve my attention to waste any on someone like her.

Is rape the only reason you would choose to dissociate yourself from someone?

I think you're a cult member.

[Taors]

Certainly I have relationships with people who are not anarchists, but I have removed pretty much everyone who is virulently statist (or completely closed-minded to liberty) from my life.

[theodorelogan]

Certainly I have relationships with people who are not anarchists, but I have removed pretty much everyone who is virulently statist (or completely closed-minded to liberty) from my life.

???

[MacFall]

Certainly I have relationships with people who are not anarchists, but I have removed pretty much everyone who is virulently statist (or completely closed-minded to liberty) from my life.

You know, the people who need to learn moar about liberty. Can't talk to them, ever. Might get cooties.

[theodorelogan]

You know, the people who need to learn moar about liberty. Can't talk to them, ever. Might get cooties.

As I said, only the people that are virulently statist....that is, completely close-minded to liberty.  I could waste years of my life with these people, or I could move on to more "fertile ground" so to speak.

Why waste my time with people who have let me know, in no uncertain terms, that they are not interested in liberty, when there are so many people that are just waiting to hear the message?

[Taors]

You know, the people who need to learn moar about liberty. Can't talk to them, ever. Might get cooties.

As I said, only the people that are virulently statist....that is, completely close-minded to liberty.  I could waste years of my life with these people, or I could move on to more "fertile ground" so to speak.

Why waste my time with people who have let me know, in no uncertain terms, that they are not interested in liberty, when there are so many people that are just waiting to hear the message?

LIBERTY LIBERTY EVERYTHING REVOLVES AROUND LIBERTY!

There's more to life than debating libertarian/anarchist bullshit with your parents, dude.

[Osborne]

That's exactly the point. Spend your valuable time with people you don't have to argue with about libertarianism.

[YixilTesiphon]

Well yeah, that's why I hang out here, but if I deal with something at work involving dumb bureaucrats or when I'm with my friends, I'll say something that isn't like "LIBERTY FUCKERS!" but that only a libertarian would say. I more go for planting the seeds of doubt and in a few months when people point out how retarded government is, I'm happy.

[Taors]

That's exactly the point. Spend your valuable time with people you don't have to argue with about libertarianism.

Why do you have to argue about libertarianism at all?

[theodorelogan]

LIBERTY LIBERTY EVERYTHING REVOLVES AROUND LIBERTY!

What can I say?  Liberty is very important to me.

There's more to life than debating libertarian/anarchist bullshit with your parents, dude.

That's exactly my point.

Why would I want to spend time with someone whose values are antithetical to my own?

Why do you have to argue about libertarianism at all?

I don't want to argue it.  I do want to talk about it.   Someone that is completely closed minded to liberty is of no interest to me.  Especially when that person believes that I should be in prison.  I don't put up with that.

The only people I bother to argue with are other libertarians (just because there are no hard feelings, and no risk of turning them off of liberty by arguing.)