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Cognitive Dissident

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Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« on: September 05, 2010, 02:52:54 PM »

I got really depressed when I heard Momma Ally on the 8/4 podcast.  It brought back painful memories.  I sometimes wonder if it isn't indeed time for someone to put some of these fascists out of our misery.  I understand that this kind of response isn't for everyone, that it may even be counterproductive, and that most of us need to be able to support non-violence in the face of violence. 

Still, there's a line, and there's no shortage of statist thugs crossing it.  I won't be surprised to see more people who have little else to live for exacting revenge on the purveyors of extreme state violence as it continues to the level that history has seen countless times before.

I've been arrested for contempt of cop twice, tortured one time and accused of "battery on a peace officer" the other (for no reason other than the laughable suggestion that the cop injured himself while abusing me--I was the one treated in the hospital, and I never lifted a hand), so I fully understand the combination of heartbreak, desperation and fury that Momma feels.

As I've pointed out in the past, we used to ask how Nazi Germany was allowed to become what it did, and no one asks that question any more (fuck reductio ad hitlerum.)  I see this as a chilling sign of the times, along with the fact that those who pay lip service to the benevolence of the state warn of the "tanks rolling in" in response to talk of secession and/or the Free State Project.  The cognitive dissonance of the masses is obvious.  The state of fear is below the conscious level of the psyche.

I was impressed by the guy who was on the show recently who said he's concerned about the next generation saying "what did you do in the face of soft fascism when something could be done?"

It's not that I haven't seriously considered detailed plans of violent response in the past.  It's that my faith in the superiority of non-violence has stopped me.  That faith is waning.

Whatever it is I do, I don't intend to be one of the old deer who have to stare into the headlights, speechless, in response to the question.  I just can't help but think that whatever a few do, the resolved are bound to be outnumbered by the timid, the weak and the unprincipled.  It is this thought that makes me believe the response must be swift and it must be remarkable. 

I'm hoping for more innovative responses such as seasteading and the FSP (if I could be in New Hampshire today I would) to become vastly more attractive to an increasingly aware public so that the less attractive and more violent options are not more commonly taken, because I fully understand the motivation behind those choices.
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BonerJoe

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #1 on: September 05, 2010, 02:56:32 PM »

Ever read Boston T. Party's "Molon Labe"?

http://www.amazon.com/Molon-Labe-Boston-T-Party/dp/1888766077
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #2 on: September 05, 2010, 02:59:05 PM »

Added to my list.
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alaric89

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #3 on: September 05, 2010, 03:49:30 PM »

If I said how I felt about all this, every one would call me a fucking Fed again. I find myself thinking The Joker on the last Batman film was on the right track, when I hear these cop stories. Especially when they go after people I admire like Mama Ally.
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hellbilly

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #4 on: September 05, 2010, 04:43:56 PM »

Challenging cops in a violent manner? You gotta be kidding.

Maybe in the 50's or 60's this would have been possible and maybe it would have even made a difference. But doing it today?

- the majority of your neighbors will turn their backs on you for attacking an officer (no help from your peers)
- if you had a small group of peers with coordinated efforts, that'd be seen as a gang/crazy militia/cult by your neighbors (no help from local citizens)
- the population of an entire small town ousts it's police force and replaces it with private security. The town would then be overrun by state police, off to jail the survivors go (no help from neighboring towns or cities)


- got rid of your local beat cop? here comes three more to replace him
- got rid of the local police department? here comes the Sheriff
- got rid of the Sheriff? here comes the State Police
- got rid of the State Police? here comes the National Guard
- got rid of the National Guard? here comes the Army

etc.

There is a definite problem with aggressive cops, but the larger problem is the tame masses of bystanders who won't do shit about it, won't say shit about it, and certainly won't be coming to the aid of persons who attack cops.

The main underlying thought is "If they're attacking the cops, they deserve what they get!" - but there's also the thought "My freedom is not worth your sacrifice." which means they aren't willing to go to jail because of your action. Even if people share your viewpoint, they're not sticking their necks out. They'll wait to see what happens to the first people who go through the wringer. Once that observation has been made, they aren't likely to do anything at all.
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Terror Australis

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2010, 03:26:38 AM »

Assassination market -  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_market

The trouble is that the servants no longer fear the served. I fear that the outcome has been chosen for us and the result is inevitable. If it was me I would evacuate the US before you're unable to do so. Who wants to be jeered at by a crowd as the cops are tasering you? This attack on Mamma Ally is revolting. Do you want this to happen to your kids?

If you were standing there watching someone get attacked by the thugs what would you do? I dont think I could live with myself if I did nothing at all. I think people need to start wearing anti taser clothing and bullet proof vests while in public. At least this might delay the eventual result and allow you to escape in time. Getting yourself a pack of dogs that might slow the cops down is an option. Or build a house with a couple of steel doors and a secret exit. Anything that lets you evade the SS.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 03:42:12 AM by Terror Australis »
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2010, 09:59:08 AM »

Again, I'm looking for alternatives to the obvious urges.

Assassination market -  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_market

The trouble is that the servants no longer fear the served. I fear that the outcome has been chosen for us and the result is inevitable. If it was me I would evacuate the US before you're unable to do so. Who wants to be jeered at by a crowd as the cops are tasering you? This attack on Mamma Ally is revolting. Do you want this to happen to your kids?

If you were standing there watching someone get attacked by the thugs what would you do? I dont think I could live with myself if I did nothing at all. I think people need to start wearing anti taser clothing and bullet proof vests while in public. At least this might delay the eventual result and allow you to escape in time. Getting yourself a pack of dogs that might slow the cops down is an option. Or build a house with a couple of steel doors and a secret exit. Anything that lets you evade the SS.

Coincidentally, this was on a Discovery Channel show last night, about the Secret Service.

http://www.miguelcaballerousa.com/
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slayerboy

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2010, 02:58:28 AM »

I listened to George Donnelley's call on the 9/3 show, then the same day heard Momma Ally's call on 9/4.  Geezus fucking christ.  Seriously, this needs to fucking end.  Then I read about the deaf dude in Seattle who got shot 4 times by a cop for whittling with a knife.

I agree, in the 50's or 60's a violent uprising might have been possible.  It's not now.  There's too many of them and they have far bigger weapons.

Inside the system activism isn't going to work.

Civil disobedience on a large enough scale might work, but not when it's only a handful of people.

I think it's time to think out of the box.  Withdraw from the system.  Stop paying taxes.  The only way to stop this is to stop funding these fools.  But, again, unless you have a ton of people doing this, it does no good.

I think this is where the FSP comes in.  I'm not foolish enough to think that the FSP is going to change anything by itself, and I don't think inside the system stuff does any good.  I think if you get a large enough group together that the lamestream media starts to take notice, average people will start to notice and see what can be done to stop this crap.

What other solution is there besides go back into a slumber and be oblivious?  I can't unlearn what I know now.  Violence solves nothing in this case, even if it is justified self-defense.  Had Momma Ally enacted self-defense that day, she wouldn't be here to talk about it.  She'd be painted as a lunatic.  This is why moving to NH temporarily, even if only for a few years, is the only solution.  Get a ton of people there, everyone stops paying taxes and generally grinds the system to a halt, the MSM picks up on it and plants a seed in peoples' minds and then it grows.

Just look at what the "Tea Parties" and Glenn Beck have done.  Granted, the ideas are pretty fucked up and flawed, but look at the outrage people have in the last year or two!  I think this is something we can win and can dismantle this system, but violence isn't the answer here.
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2010, 12:37:45 PM »

Remember too that the tea parties started libertarian and were usurped by the Republican party.
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alaric89

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2010, 06:57:17 AM »

I calmed down a little. Excellent OP I would like to respond.
I have also got a cop beat down, so I understand Mama Ally's freak out as well.
I hope liberty lovers who are successful for liberty outside activism- Mama Ally, Jasen Osbourne, Glen Jacobs etc. stay the hell out of the cops way, we need those people doing what they do best.   
We have more than enough professional cop catchers and protesters.
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Terror Australis

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2010, 10:01:28 AM »

Do you think Ron Paul would win if he ran for president in 2012?
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anarchir

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2010, 10:10:01 AM »

Do you think Ron Paul would win if he ran for president in 2012?

Not a chance.
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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2010, 10:56:31 AM »

Do you think Ron Paul would win if he ran for president in 2012?

Not a chance in hell. No Libertarian type guy will become president with 80% of americans on some kind of government giveaway program of some type. If he runs again, I'll vote for him but it wont mean anything really. I'd like to see Gary Johnson run, but same thing there......... not a chance. 
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Terror Australis

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2010, 10:57:24 AM »

Do you think Ron Paul would win if he ran for president in 2012?

Not a chance.

Well then you'd better bend over and put your head between your knees and kiss your ass goodbye. :P
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Cognitive Dissident

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Re: Momma Ally's Beat-Down
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2010, 12:38:53 PM »

Do you think Ron Paul would win if he ran for president in 2012?

Not a chance.

Well then you'd better bend over and put your head between your knees and kiss your ass goodbye. :P

The way it's starting to work out for guys like Ron Paul is to demonstrate that the system doesn't work.  Tell the Paul voters that if they're tired of beating their heads against the wall trying to make the system work, it's time to come Alongside Night.
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